Humanity’s Lens: “Being There” - Prologue

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Postby IanEye » Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:37 am

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I guess my main focus was really to have a common freshly viewed film to talk about. The idea that you sort of “earn” your way through the door by taking the time to actually watch the film. But, at that point you have “earned” the right to focus on whatever aspect of the film you want. I guess there is a certain amount of elitism inherent in this. But at the same time, two films down the line, I could be a victim of this same elitism, which I feel sort of evens the playing field in the long run. The next film chosen could be one that I couldn’t obtain a copy of is what I am saying, so I would have to sit that one out.

I chose “Being There” for a lot of reasons. I don’t really want to get into all of them now, I’d prefer to wait a week (the 23rd seems fitting), until more people have seen the film. But it seemed a good one in terms of the various themes within it, and also the greater “meta” aspects around the making of the film itself and the era in which it was made.

In closing, I don’t think I am giving too much away when I say that “Being There” resonates with Kubrick’s “Eyes Wide Shut” in a strong way for me.

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Movie club name

Postby tazmic » Fri Feb 15, 2008 1:51 pm

I would like to offer the following alternative name. Instead of Humanity's Lens, how about....?

The Glass Tit :shock:
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Re: Movie club name

Postby sunny » Fri Feb 15, 2008 1:54 pm

tazmic wrote:I would like to offer the following alternative name. Instead of Humanity's Lens, how about....?

The Glass Tit :shock:


I'm not feeling that one, tazmic.

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Re: Movie club name

Postby IanEye » Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:08 pm

tazmic wrote:I would like to offer the following alternative name. Instead of Humanity's Lens, how about....?

The Glass Tit :shock:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Glass_Teat

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i get the reference tazmic, and it is apt. Ellison was one of my faves as a youth....
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The Glass Tit

Postby tazmic » Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:56 pm

OMG! :D Thanks for the image.

If anyone is interested, www.glass-tit.tv is still available :wink:
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Culture Studies - Be There.

Postby Hugh Manatee Wins » Sun Feb 17, 2008 1:50 am

Jeff just created a new forum, "Culture Studies," good place for this movie thang-

http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board/viewtopic.php?t=16199

brainpanhandler wrote:
Hugh wrote:A pause button, a pen, a notepad. Very deliberate examination yields interesting details.

.....
Does it ever occur to you that perhaps "very deliberate examination" might yield a myopic view of things?


:shock: "Examination = myopic" ? No. Just the opposite.

Do you even know how to interpret your experience in any other way?


Other than with critical thinking and context? No.
Because myopia results when you make the mistake of thinking that a construct ("art" or "product" or whatever) exists in a vacuum.
It doesn't. Time and place, people, themes, nuts and bolts of content, etc.

I'm guessing you didn't read the links I put up about 'Being There.' Oh well. (Try'em.)
There are films I saw in younger less-informed days which I've had to re-watch only to find they were psy-ops.

Many many movies ARE psy-ops and I will continue to post on that angle while others take different approaches based on what they see or know.

.....I would be even more curious to have Hugh offer some examples of films of some import and quality that do NOT fit into his pet memes (on it's own thread). I imagine that would be a pretty short list.


My time is spent on non-fiction but since the tricks of CIA-Hollywood became apparent to me I've watched so much psy-ops mendacity in post-CIA movies that I've become fond of the early silents, Buster Keaton especially.

One guilty pleasure is Bobcat Goldthwaite's 'Shakes the Clown,' called by the Boston Globe "the Citizen Kane of alcoholic clown movies." :P
This site offers a nice overview of Hal Ashby's work.
http://www.imagesjournal.com/issue08/features/halashby/


Thanks for the Ashby link.
Sorry, you'll probably hate my mentioning this, but lots was confirmed for me. It made historical sense as I see (know) it.
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Re: Culture Studies - Be There.

Postby brainpanhandler » Sun Feb 17, 2008 5:10 am

Hugh wrote:
brainpanhandler wrote:
Hugh wrote:A pause button, a pen, a notepad. Very deliberate examination yields interesting details.

.....
Does it ever occur to you that perhaps "very deliberate examination" might yield a myopic view of things?


:shock: "Examination = myopic" ? No. Just the opposite.


Yes, of course. What was I thinking? I meant just the opposite of what I said. I was exactly wrong to even wonder about such a thing, 180 degrees backward. C'mon Hugh, surely you know by now that it is precisely this sort of dickheaded answer that pisses people off. Do yourself a favor and start cultivating the ability to start by giving people the benefit of the doubt and resisting your passive/aggresive impulse to mock people and your chances of finding a more receptive audience will increase dramatically. But maybe that's not what you want?

From MW:
Main Entry:
my•o•pia
Pronunciation:
\mī-ˈō-pē-ə\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
New Latin, from Greek myōpia, from myōp-, myōps
Date:
circa 1752
1 : a condition in which the visual images come to a focus in front of the retina of the eye resulting especially in defective vision of distant objects 2 : a lack of foresight or discernment : a narrow view of something


Would you agree that the way you view media is distinct from the way most people view the same media? Is it possible that any of that distinction results from something other than the fact that the general populace is brainwashed? My point was that there has to be some explanation for why you can be so right on and then so ridiculously off in your analyses of media. Giving you the benefit of the doubt, I assume that 16 years of immersing yourself in your studies of the media/psy-ops/propaganda/KWH has so narrowed your focus that you sometimes lose sight of other ways of interpreting things. See how that works? It's a metaphor. An alternative theory is that you actually wish to discredit the theory of psy-ops/KWH in mass media by offering alternately sound and unsound analyses.

I can guarantee you that in watching Being There for what must be the 4th or 5th time I will have the remote handy, as well as a pad and a pen.

Do you even know how to interpret your experience in any other way?

Other than with critical thinking and context? No.


Still bein' a dickhead. You know damn well what I mean. I guess there really is no other way to communicate with you than to write every last thought as strictly, carefully, narowly and as misinterpretably as possible, which is a pain in the ass. A lens necessarily distorts. That's another metaphor. I try to approach media with an unbiased eye to begin with. I try. That's my first operating premise. I don't want to be lead around by my prover trying prove what the thinker already thinks.

I'm guessing you didn't read the links I put up about 'Being There.' Oh well. (Try'em.)


Yes I did. I would not have opened my big mouth if I had not. I did not find what you said was there. I looked, carefully. I put on my Hugh Mantee glasses and got out my decoder ring but alas I am not the detective you are. Unfortunately experience has taught me that you are as liable to produce nonsense as anything else and so one possible explanation is that whatever you think is there is not discernible to someone not given to stretching and distorting the evidence to fit the theory. That's the explanation I am favoring at the moment.

One guilty pleasure is Bobcat Goldthwaite's 'Shakes the Clown,' called by the Boston Globe "the Citizen Kane of alcoholic clown movies."


I've not seen it. His voice irritates the shit out of me. Ok, I'll bite, why is it a guilty pleasure Hugh? Oddly enough, I just posted a link to Killer Clowns from Space (full movie) on the Loving the Alien thread in the lounge.



I look forward to what this thread might produce. I even look forward to your take on things, because truly you have altered my view and added to my knowledge. Given your history with the people who have thus far expressed an interest in the OP however, it is not hard to imagine a scenario where most conversations orbit around the black hole of psy-ops/KWH theories and devolve into shouting matches over that.

Is it possible that a film may have been altered or engineered to serve a psy-ops purpose and yet still have some merit on other levels as a work of art?
"Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." - Martin Luther King Jr.
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Postby brainpanhandler » Sun Feb 17, 2008 5:17 am

BTW...
Hugh wrote:Many many movies ARE psy-ops and I will continue to post on that angle while others take different approaches based on what they see or know.


...I would be disappointed if this were not the case.
"Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." - Martin Luther King Jr.
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Re: Culture Studies - Be There.

Postby IanEye » Sun Feb 17, 2008 2:23 pm

Hugh Manatee Wins wrote:My time is spent on non-fiction but since the tricks of CIA-Hollywood became apparent to me I've watched so much psy-ops mendacity in post-CIA movies that I've become fond of the early silents, Buster Keaton especially.


Well, I don't want to get ahead of myself, but studying pre World War II films would be pretty cool.

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Of course, any pre-WWII film could have a "psychological operation" aspect inherent to it, it's just it wouldn't be a CIA psy-op. Indeed it could be nothing more than solely the director's desire to mind-fuck a crowd.

It might be very refreshing to discuss films as manipulative devices with you Hugh, without the CIA ever entering the discussion. Cool idea...

"Mabuse The Gambler" is way cool btw. Lang gives away a lot of economic strategies directly employed by the Rothschilds and others to consolidate power in the late 19th/early 20th centuries. That Mabuse, he knew when to hold 'em and when to fold 'em.
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Re: Culture Studies - Be There.

Postby Hugh Manatee Wins » Sun Feb 17, 2008 2:38 pm

IanEye wrote:Of course, any pre-WWII film could have a "psychological operation" aspect inherent to it, it's just it wouldn't be a CIA psy-op. Indeed it could be nothing more than solely the director's desire to mind-fuck a crowd.

It might be very refreshing to discuss films as manipulative devices with you Hugh, without the CIA ever entering the discussion. Cool idea...

"Mabuse The Gambler" is way cool btw. Lang gives away a lot of economic strategies directly employed by the Rothschilds and others to consolidate power in the late 19th/early 20th centuries. That Mabuse, he knew when to hold 'em and when to fold 'em.


Cool, didn't know about 'Mabuse.' Sounds fascinating.
Sorry, mentioning Lang reminds me that George Lucas ripped off 'Metropolis' for the Star Wars robot 'C3PO.' A guy who worked for Boeing also did lots of design for Lucas.
Image

Image

BTW- "C3" is a military abbreviation for "Command, Control, and Communication."



I recently picked up 'The Cabinet of Dr. Caligari' (1919).

Evil control of a somnambulist used to kill the enemies of the head of an insane asylum.
Great use of distorted perspective stage sets (pre-Batman tv show) to mix up dream and waking worlds. Who is the controller and who is the controlled, who is insane and who isn't...

Yes, these questions about perception management and control pre-date the institutionalized military-intelligence use of cultural cues and were first used by...artists.

Once upon a time, art imitated life.
But then, the neuroscience of mind-control allowed the process to be reversed.

Now, life imitates what is passed off for "art" but is really product designed to be a delivery system for psy-ops.

Recommended book-
Image
From Caligari to Hitler
by Siegfried Kracauer (Author), Leonardo Quaresima (Editor)

Publisher: Princeton University Press; New Ed edition (May 1, 1966)

This book shows how the cinema paralleled and sometimes helped form the German psyche. Yet it is more than just a documentary. This brings you from the beginning of the industry to show what Hitler inherited. However the information caries far beyond the political dimension.
Last edited by Hugh Manatee Wins on Sun Feb 17, 2008 2:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Culture Studies - Be There.

Postby IanEye » Sun Feb 17, 2008 2:51 pm

Hugh Manatee Wins wrote:
Cool, didn't know about 'Mabuse.' Sounds fascinating.


from the Criterion Collection website:

A sequel to his enormously successful silent film Dr. Mabuse: The Gambler, Fritz Lang's The Testament of Dr. Mabuse reunites the director with the character that had effectively launched his career. Lang put slogans and ideas expounded by the Nazis into the mouth of a madman, warning his audience of an imminent menace, which was soon to become a reality. Nazi Minister of Information Joseph Goebels saw the film as an instruction manual for terrorist action against the government and banned it for “endangering public order and security.”

http://www.criterion.com/asp/release.asp?id=231

Definitely worth your time, Hugh.
Save the pad and pencil for the second viewing....
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Re: Culture Studies - Be There.

Postby Hugh Manatee Wins » Sun Feb 17, 2008 3:00 pm

IanEye wrote:......
Lang put slogans and ideas expounded by the Nazis into the mouth of a madman, warning his audience of an imminent menace, which was soon to become a reality. Nazi Minister of Information Joseph Goebels saw the film as an instruction manual for terrorist action against the government and banned it for “endangering public order and security.”[/i]

http://www.criterion.com/asp/release.asp?id=231

Definitely worth your time, Hugh.
Save the pad and pencil for the second viewing....


Woa. That's heavy.
The Nazis knew how powerful movies are and so do their successors.
This is why distribution to megaplexes for TV Nation's teenagers is not left to mere artists.

Dang, we've come full circle to 'Being There' (a cover-up of a CIA-Nazi connection) and 'Darth Vader' (a pseudo-Nazi Other for kids to attack),

This is why I focus on movies as where MKULTRA meets the masses.
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Postby §ê¢rꆧ » Mon Feb 18, 2008 9:31 am

Count me in... I'm downloading "Being There" here:
LINK

Eight parts on Rapidshare is a bit of a pain, but for those without Netflix/video stores nearby...

I'd also like to point out a similar thread to this one - book reviews!

http://rigorousintuition.ca/board/viewtopic.php?t=15698
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Postby professorpan » Mon Feb 18, 2008 11:41 am

Another promising thread derailed into the predictable "It's a psyop!" discussion killer. Gee, I didn't expect that.

I sometimes imagine how nice it would be like to discuss a film's artistic, sociocultural, and aesthetic merits on this board without it degenerating into a pro/con argument about you-know-who's grand media conspiracies.

Chew tobacco, rookie.
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Postby IanEye » Mon Feb 18, 2008 12:05 pm

professorpan wrote:I sometimes imagine how nice it would be like to discuss a film's artistic, sociocultural, and aesthetic merits on this board without it degenerating into a pro/con argument about you-know-who's grand media conspiracies.


don't worry Pan - i think by this weekend enough people will have taken the time to see the film that an interesting discussion will emerge - and in the end, only those who have taken that time should be participating, so, we'll see how that goes....

I figure I will leave this thread in "General Discussion" until about Thursday and then I will ask Jeff to move it over to the new "Cultural Studies" section.

Plus, we have learned that Hugh likes the film "Shakes The Clown", I certainly didn't see that coming.
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