Pay no mind to the Mossad agent on the line

[timetunneler]

The NWO behind 9/11 engineered it to have a layer where people were pointing "to the Jews". Thats why they had Israeli spies in some vague attached role even if the spies themselves were not in on it.

The first conspiracy theories regarding 9/11 were "missing Jews/Israel did it", even top Pakistani ISI officials who were in on 9/11 were saying "Mossad did it". Bush even said "let us never tolerate outrageous conspiracy theories about 9/11" because even in november 2001 people were starting to question 9/11...
and it was important to associate 9/11 questions with Anti Semitism

Netanyahu has repeatedly said "9/11 was VERY good for Israel".

9/11 was also good for Russia, England, and the rest of the globalist goons out there.

Like you always say in your replies... You got it... the Israeli/Jewish angle to 9/11 is an attempt by the powers that be to keep people from getting too close to examining 9/11 by placing Israelis and Jewish people in front of the areas that the PTB don't want to be examined.

So you will see that Cheney, Bush and Rumsfeld are surrounded by Jews.. and to attack the lies that led the U.S. into Iraq, you first have to attack guys like Feith and Wolfowitz and Scooter Libby.

To attack Rumsfeld for losing 2.3 Trillion you have to attack Pentagon Comptroller Dov Zakheim. To examine the possibility of Remote Controlled planes on 9/11 you are also drawn back to Dov Zakheim and his Corporate VP position with System Planning Corporation and their links to remote control planes.

If you want to jump on someone for tricking the US into Iraq. You first have to jump on designated African American fall guy Colin Powell for the bogus Iraq intel he gave at the UN.

If you want to jump on someone for shredding the U.S. Constitution, helping to bring the Patriot act to life and allowing torture you have the ethnic gatekeepers of Alberto Gonzalez and John Yoo.

You will notice that immediately after 9/11, Fox News wasted no time dragging in the Israelis to get blamed for it with the Cameron stories but then they immediately dropped it. So essentially they said, hey shut your mouth or we might just pin this whole thing on you.

This is the one fear I have about Obama... that maybe he is being manipulated and that when he becomes president the PTB fascists will use the black guy to put a happy face on some really horrible shit.

I don't think Israel "did it". But I do think Israelis, Saudi Royals and U.S./NATO puppet masters conspired together in stage managing 9/11. I still think the operational center for 9/11 lies in secret groups within the U.S. and Europe. And I do not believe at this point that the hijackers actually did anything on 9/11. I tend to believe they were drug runners who were guided to get on planes and then when the planes crashed they were used as scapegoats to take the blame.

Based on this article about a Greek plane that crashed where the people all died in flight due to freezing to death and losing oxygen:
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe/08 ... index.html

...it makes me wonder if the people on the 9/11 planes were killed in a way like this and then remote control took over. Never heard of people dying on a plane like that until I heard that story.

But like I was saying, Jewish people, and other ethnicities IMHO are being used as a firewall to prevent people from blaming the real masterminds by saying , hey if you want to blame us you have to blame them first.

[timetunneler]

1 There are lots of Jewish people in Hollywood

Aw, but how many in Hollywood FLORIDA, where Unaltered not think it odd Israeli spies were living on the SAME STREET at the SAME TIME as the hijackers in 2001. Israel had guys spying on the hijackers, yet unaltered cant see that, raising the "Jews didnt make it to work" fake meme as the face of questioning Israel.

I am not sure what you mean by "counting the Jews" - do you mean the old canard about none dying at the WTC? I havent seen people talk about that since the list of WTC dead came out (you might be meaning something else). My thesis is that a lot of the people in this "Meta Group" are from a Russian-Ukrainian-Israeli network with deep connections to far right European American establishment group and also strong Turkish / Central Asian connections (e.g. Bin Laden was the worlds largest heroin boss...)

Well we know Osama was knee deep in drug trade, most likely through the Turkish/Kosovo(out of Afghanistan and Chechnya) NATO routes.

CIA and NATO were literally using al Qaeda in Bosnia, which is the absolutely backbone to 9/11, dovetailing with the Putin FSB staged terrorism in 1999 that lead to the 1999 and on Chechyn war(which most the hijackers were training for)

We know Mohamed Atta was involved with German national drug smugglers in Florida, most likely linked to protected CIA operations. Just like protected Saudi charities, and CIA linked relief groups were dotting the landscape.

A "meta group" indeed, but many want to say "Osama did it", "Israel did it", "Bush did it". 9/11=Metajob, where the neocons, Jews or a cavedwelling boogeyman is the usual fallguy to most.

9/11 = Transnational Operation to Start Wars and Make Cash

IMHO, the U.S. and NATO in Belgium probably masterminded it.

Players within Israel, Saudi Arabia and Pakistan (and other places) put their chips in the game too.

Saudis provided the dip shit patsies, Pakistan did their traditional role as terrorist training and spawning zone.

Israel, Germans and Able Danger among others ran surveillance on the hijackers to make sure they kept on their drug routes so they could eventually be manipulated by FBI agent provocatuers to be in the right places leaving cookie crumbs so they could eventually get on those planes and leave a trail pointing back to them.

You have to remember, the only evidence that says these guys were 9/11 hijackers and planned 9/11 is the cookie crumb trail they left that we are told means THESE GUYS ARE TERRORISTS WHO HATE AMERICA. But of course when you look at the cookie crumbs there is nothing really there. Just anecedotal(sp?) stuff.

No tapped phones conversations, no taped audio of plans, no video of them discussing it, no detailed notes or hand written notes of any plans. No real evidence most of them knew how to fly jetliners. Most of the evidence simply points to the fact they were clueless drug runners being run by handlers.

[timetunneler]

You act like there's no difference between "Jews did 9/11, Jews didnt show up for WTC work" and looking into Israeli spy rings in 1997-2001 America

I've tried to explain I don't but if you MUST feel that way, go ahead.

And yes, I do think there is nothing fishy about Art students who were never proven to be any more than that living 8 tenths of a mile away from terrorists. I mean I try and imagine why Super Mossad would continue to use a busted operation for a year and a half like fucking Keystone cops

Everything I've ever read on the art students says they were very aggressive in spying on and attempting to infiltrate the DEA.

What that means to me is just like the short lived Fox News segment on Israeli spies in the U.S. tailing the hijackers... the Israelis were themselves probably also playing a GRAYMAIL game with the USA. (Or as jackRiddler said earlier an intimidation racket)

We are watching you as you are obviously up to some nasty shit just like you are watching us watching you do nasty shit.

Boils down to this. ALOT of groups in the USA and abroad were tailing the hijackers... nonetheless 9/11 went through anyways. So you have to groups watching the hijackers and each other threatening to release dirt on the other if one pulls out of the operation.

Of course unaltered is going to write back a flowing river of denial about how the hijackers were being watched yet nonetheless no one really knew what they were up to... and to that I simply reply...

JEMMA PLEASE

[timetunneler]

In the end, I see Bush sitting in that classroom, not at all wondering what the hell Card meant and looking guilty as sin, while the Secret Service and WHMO and the rest of the entourage go ahead with the photo op as scheduled to the minute, and then the Pentagon gets hit 51 minutes after the first tower, on a morning when the military and other agencies had incidentally scheduled wargames and drills to rehearse multiple domestic hijackings, planes hitting buildings in Washington, an emergency in New York and a nuckular war with the Russians. And afterwards no one in the chain of command can get their mutually exclusive AWOL stories straight about where they were or what they did, but three years later the Commission fixes that for them by inventing a single timeline that exonerates them all as stupid, just in time for an American election in which, as usual, Stupid Wins. But they are ready to seize the enabling event with every tentacle, launch two invasions planned in advance, declare a permanent global state of war, shift trillions of dollars on behalf of their corporations and friends, transform how the society and its politics are defined, and implement nearly every inch of an agenda they had ready but could not have effected otherwise.

That tells me a whole universe already about who is obviously involved, at the top levels of the official US government, which is a great place to be at the start of investigating what happened, since more often you need to trace your way up from some dimestore burglary up through many levels of fog to the Burglar-in-Chief, and thus I don't have to speculate about whether some Israelis several leagues down the food chain were really dancing when the Jersey cops nabbed them.

My belief too. I'd throw in a bit of NATO though. But I think you pretty much summed up who was behind 9/11 and why.

/thread

[JackRiddler]

timetunneler:

What you said reminds me of how German feudal princes tended to keep a Judenminister, a Jewish minister of finance whom the people would hate for taxing them and who would be banished or executed after an uprising to pacify the masses and keep them loving their monarch. I think your analysis of how the core criminals use "ethnic" gatekeepers to put a different face on their atrocities is pretty much spot-on. You forgot Ari Fleischer, but who remembers him nowadays? (Interesting how the first Bush White House press shill was a completely inarticulate moron and how each successor was successively slightly more communicative and friendly... like dropping balast on a perpetually sinking balloon.)

This is the one fear I have about Obama... that maybe he is being manipulated and that when he becomes president the PTB fascists will use the black guy to put a happy face on some really horrible shit.

If he gets in and things go badly it will all be blamed on his being black. You will see the return of the Clinton-defamation campaign times ten.

[8bitagent]

If you endorse the hypothesis that black ops of the kind being posited were in the picture at all, it's at best misleading and at worst a fallacy to try to sort the operatives according to which national intelligence agency they worked for. At that level, they're not acting for national interests, or even multi-national interests, properly speaking. They're acting for a meta-national power complex that feels the same kind of foolish unbridled love for some specific nation-states that people who are insanely devoted to their pets do for their dogs, cats, parrots, and weasels, or whatever. They're almost like members of the family. But only almost, and not to the extent that they'd think twice about putting them to sleep if, owing to some change in the global scenario, continuing to care for them became an impediment to occupational functioning.

I'd be astonished if some elements of what is technically the American intelligence community were involved in this particular scheme and some elements of what are technically the intelligence communities of Israel and the UK (among others) weren't. I guess that if I learned that some elements of Chinese intelligence were also pitching in, that might be surprising. But in general terms, meta-nationally is just how powers who do shit like bring down the World Trade Center roll. I don't see how it's helpful to rule out any of the usual suspects that some evidence suggests may have been players in the planning or execution of the attacks. The evidence isn't so fully in that I feel I can count them out.

Like Jack Rrrrr, I try to keep my eye on the highest visible point olf the power pyramid that it's my business and my right to oversee. But that's for practical reasons. A primary one of which is discouraging the rise of a meta-national power complex with an extensive black-ops network, evidence for the existence and various technical national origins of whose members I therefore have to be open to acknowledging.

I agree with the term "meta-national power complex".

If you look at how the FBI was kept from going after terror funding and terrorists all throughout the Clinton years and the 2001 of Bush's presidency, then look at how at every nexus point of the "al Qaeda" network there's protected CIA/ISI assets...along with Indonesian government assets, MI6, etc...

It almost feels like each agency, each converging layer are mere proxy tools able to be tapped into and manipulated worldwide...both corporate and black world criminal wise by *something*. That "something" is something Ive speculated.

Scratch my back, I'll scratch yours? A meta theatrical play where the actors do not know the other's lines? How else can one explain the complicity of elements of the US government, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, England, possibly Israel, certainly Dubai, Malaysia, Indonesia, etc?

Aw, such is the wonderful mystery of the beast, the octopus. Where drugs, artificial data mining intelligence, offshore banks, alphabet soup agencies and willingly duped jihadists tango til the wee hours of the morning.

[8bitagent]

The NWO behind 9/11 engineered it to have a layer where people were pointing "to the Jews". Thats why they had Israeli spies in some vague attached role even if the spies themselves were not in on it.

The first conspiracy theories regarding 9/11 were "missing Jews/Israel did it", even top Pakistani ISI officials who were in on 9/11 were saying "Mossad did it". Bush even said "let us never tolerate outrageous conspiracy theories about 9/11" because even in november 2001 people were starting to question 9/11...
and it was important to associate 9/11 questions with Anti Semitism

Netanyahu has repeatedly said "9/11 was VERY good for Israel".

9/11 was also good for Russia, England, and the rest of the globalist goons out there.

Like you always say in your replies... You got it... the Israeli/Jewish angle to 9/11 is an attempt by the powers that be to keep people from getting too close to examining 9/11 by placing Israelis and Jewish people in front of the areas that the PTB don't want to be examined.

So you will see that Cheney, Bush and Rumsfeld are surrounded by Jews.. and to attack the lies that led the U.S. into Iraq, you first have to attack guys like Feith and Wolfowitz and Scooter Libby.

To attack Rumsfeld for losing 2.3 Trillion you have to attack Pentagon Comptroller Dov Zakheim. To examine the possibility of Remote Controlled planes on 9/11 you are also drawn back to Dov Zakheim and his Corporate VP position with System Planning Corporation and their links to remote control planes.

If you want to jump on someone for tricking the US into Iraq. You first have to jump on designated African American fall guy Colin Powell for the bogus Iraq intel he gave at the UN.

If you want to jump on someone for shredding the U.S. Constitution, helping to bring the Patriot act to life and allowing torture you have the ethnic gatekeepers of Alberto Gonzalez and John Yoo.

You will notice that immediately after 9/11, Fox News wasted no time dragging in the Israelis to get blamed for it with the Cameron stories but then they immediately dropped it. So essentially they said, hey shut your mouth or we might just pin this whole thing on you.

This is the one fear I have about Obama... that maybe he is being manipulated and that when he becomes president the PTB fascists will use the black guy to put a happy face on some really horrible shit.

I don't think Israel "did it". But I do think Israelis, Saudi Royals and U.S./NATO puppet masters conspired together in stage managing 9/11. I still think the operational center for 9/11 lies in secret groups within the U.S. and Europe. And I do not believe at this point that the hijackers actually did anything on 9/11. I tend to believe they were drug runners who were guided to get on planes and then when the planes crashed they were used as scapegoats to take the blame.

Based on this article about a Greek plane that crashed where the people all died in flight due to freezing to death and losing oxygen:
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe/08 ... index.html

...it makes me wonder if the people on the 9/11 planes were killed in a way like this and then remote control took over. Never heard of people dying on a plane like that until I heard that story.

But like I was saying, Jewish people, and other ethnicities IMHO are being used as a firewall to prevent people from blaming the real masterminds by saying , hey if you want to blame us you have to blame them first.

You got it! Masterfully said.

There's MANY layers to "blame" in 9/11.

The first obvious layers the elites want you to blame for 9/11 are
"Muslims".

The second layer, is "The Jews". This is why the elite pump the most fervently anti Semitic bullshit in the Arab world and in Europe while ALSO making sure Israel goes out of its way to do some pretty heinous stuff.

Its also clever how the elites make sure that the "powers that be" in America are surrounded by "Jews". Wolfowitz, Perle, Fife, Zakheim,
Rumsfeld, AIPAC guys, etc. They make it so you cant criticize the neocons lest ye be accused of being a "Jew hater"(Another benefit of the NWO orchestrating the holocaust)

So if youre too smart to believe merely fanatic Muslims did 9/11, and youre too smart to think "The Jews" did 9/11...well the NWO has ANOTHER layer it wants you to fall for:

"Bush and the neocons". They want you to think that Bush and Cheney were remote controlling planes from a secret bunker, smoking a cigar
while remoting a "missile" into the Pentagon with noone on board the planes.

"The Neocons". The neocons are just a bunch of sock puppets who were placed in the White House, knowing full well they'd be more than willing to run with 9/11 unlike a Gore administration would.

Yet, people think Bush and Cheney "did" 9/11. Give me a break.

The real "people" behind 9/11 are the nastiest, darkest souls you will never see on television. They are of no country, no Abrahamic faith,
and beholden to no financial gain. They only care about creating death, and the grand specter of massive collective trauma.

For them, it's easy to manipulate Islamic fundamentalists to do their bidding, pulling the strings on elements of world intelligence agencies and corporate/financial apparatus'.

9/11 will never "be solved", because many of the people we "think" are in on it, and may have played a role...themselves may not even be aware that they were in on it.

People in their heart can believe that Cheney or Osama or whomever the fuck "did" 9/11, but all it is, is mirrorgazing into the eyes of a trickster.

Finally, you said
This is the one fear I have about Obama... that maybe he is being manipulated and that when he becomes president the PTB fascists will use the black guy to put a happy face on some really horrible shit.

Oh Lordy, you hit the nail on the head. This is something even Hugh can't see.

The elite want to throw the neocons out, like the used up pitbull sock puppets they were always meant to play, and fool everyone with a "squeaky clean Democratic hero" to wipe the foul taste of Bush out of our mouths...
collectively lulling us to sleep. "Yes, there there now...everything will be ok, Obama is your ruler now"....

Meanwhile, the most soul crushingly shocking events, and the collapse of America and the impetus of WW3 get underway.

[unaltered]

And I'm supposed to believe YOU rather than an actual verifiable ABC link? lol

Hey, Unaltered, don't take it from me. Take it from this guy. He was there! Yeah, no way, you say. Yes way. He was there ON TOP of the van with his 4 pals, and guess what he says? He says "our purpose was to document the event". Huh, go figure.

That explains the camcorder, although the reason for the dancing has yet to be determined.

Check out what he says back home in November, 2001:

"our purpose was to document the event"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zx9q5N8iV68

And you believe this means "our purpose was to document the event for Mossad?" Well, obviously you do. I don't know what to say to you now. I certainly don't want to get tied up into an insult fest so I'll just say I'm dumbfounded to find you just may believe that is what he meant.

[8bitagent]

Israel, Germans and Able Danger among others ran surveillance on the hijackers to make sure they kept on their drug routes so they could eventually be manipulated by FBI agent provocatuers to be in the right places leaving cookie crumbs so they could eventually get on those planes and leave a trail pointing back to them.

You have to remember, the only evidence that says these guys were 9/11 hijackers and planned 9/11 is the cookie crumb trail they left that we are told means THESE GUYS ARE TERRORISTS WHO HATE AMERICA. But of course when you look at the cookie crumbs there is nothing really there. Just anecedotal(sp?) stuff.

No tapped phones conversations, no taped audio of plans, no video of them discussing it, no detailed notes or hand written notes of any plans. No real evidence most of them knew how to fly jetliners. Most of the evidence simply points to the fact they were clueless drug runners being run by handlers.

I agree, the most staunch pro Bush person should see that clearly, the "19 hijackers" soul purpose was to make as MUCH NOISE as possible. Bread crumb trails like you wouldnt believe it. Cocaine, sex toys, video taping at airports, credit cards(Which were STILL in USE weeks after 9/11), etc.

However, the NWO has perfected for many many aeons how to get would be young jihadists to "martyr". Be it MK Ultra like tape looks at mosques,
radical imans and clerics to brainwash, provocatuer agents, you name it...many ways to create a willing Mcveigh, as well as a patsy Oswald. Both serve a purpose.

On the surface, 9/11 appears to be about strategic land grabbing, money, and the usual BCCI bullshit. But looked at in the context of every other aeon changing world event that bear the unmistakable palm prints of the elite; I see something much more darker and perplexing. Demonic, really.

Lord knows what truly, truly went down that day...in the towers, on those planes. I dare not even speculate...perhaps we're not even meant to know.

All I know is I doubt very highly "Cheney" or "Israel" or the usual suspects "orchestrated" 9/11. 9/11 was in the works since before the neocons even took office, and all one has to do is look at the origins of the two buildings used in the attacks to see that. Bush and Osama, just two puppets of the beast.

[AlicetheKurious]

It's fascinating -- and frustrating -- how, time and again, a smokescreen of emotional blackmail rapidly engulfs any rational attempt to analyse the 9/11 attacks as a crime through the framework of the standard questions: 1) "cui bono?" 2) who had the resources to carry out this crime? 3) who had the clear motive? and 4) who was in a position to recognize and exploit the opportunity to carry it off?

Based on these four questions, a specific group of closely inter-related ideological fanatics all linked to Ariel Sharon and Israel's right-wing Likud Party should be at the very top of the list of suspects. They were (per$onally and ideologically) the prime beneficiaries of the attacks, they had the resources to pull it off, they wrote down their motive in black and white prior to the crime and they, after George W. Bush's (s)election in 2000, were in the perfect position to recognize and exploit (if not create) the window of opportunity that allowed the attacks to take place almost without a hitch.

I'm not sure how the Israeli spies fit in this picture, because there are so damn many of them swarming all over the place for years before the attacks, so I usually don't focus on them. For all I know, Jack is correct, and some of them are involved in the drug trade -- but then, what were others doing hanging around nuclear facilities, walking around with detailed maps of high-security installations and ringing the doorbells of high-level military personnel?

Even more importantly, why were these 'students' and 'movers' popping up in Manhattan on 9/11, in white vans smelling of or packed with explosives that contained boxcutters and false passports? Remember that the Israeli 'warnings' had specified 200 terrorists -- maybe that was the way it was supposed to go down, but that part of the plan didn't work because these "dancing Israelis" messed up. Clearly, the majority were quite young, hardly seasoned Mossad operatives.

Since you all seem to want to focus on the Dancing Israelis instead of the evidence pointing to the planners, beneficiaries and top-level executors of the attacks, let's do that for a minute. Here's a summary that provides additional, extremely telling, details that we haven't discussed yet:


The Five Dancing Israelis
Arrested On 9-11


As the world watched in disbelief and asked the question...

Who did this?

A Mossad surveillance team made quite a public spectacle of themselves on 9-11.

The New York Times reported Thursday that a group of five men had set up video cameras aimed at the Twin Towers prior to the attack on Tuesday, and were seen congratulating one another afterwards. (1)

Police received several calls from angry New Jersey residents claiming "middle-eastern" men with a white van were videotaping the disaster with shouts of joy and mockery. (2)

"They were like happy, you know � They didn't look shocked to me" said a witness. (3)

[T]hey were seen by New Jersey residents on Sept. 11 making fun of the World Trade Center ruins and going to extreme lengths to photograph themselves in front of the wreckage. (4)

Witnesses saw them jumping for joy in Liberty State Park after the initial impact (5). Later on, other witnesses saw them celebrating on a roof in Weehawken, and still more witnesses later saw them celebrating with high fives in a Jersey City parking lot. (6)

"It looked like they're hooked in with this. It looked like they knew what was going to happen when they were at Liberty State Park." (7)

One anonymous phone call to the authorities actually led them to close down all of New York's bridges and tunnels. The mystery caller told the 9-1-1 dispatcher that a group of Palestinians were mixing a bomb inside of a white van headed for the Holland Tunnel.

Here's the transcript from NBC News:

Dispatcher: Jersey City police.

Caller: Yes, we have a white van, 2 or 3 guys in there, they look like Palestinians and going around a building.

Caller: There's a minivan heading toward the Holland tunnel, I see the guy by Newark Airport mixing some junk and he has those sheikh uniform.

Dispatcher: He has what?

Caller: He's dressed like an Arab. (8 )

(*Writer's note: Why would this mystery caller specifically say that these "Arabs" were Palestinians? How would he know that? Palestinians usually dress in western style clothes, not "sheikh uniforms")

Based on that phone call, police then issued a "Be-on-the-Lookout" alert for a white mini-van heading for the city's bridges and tunnels from New Jersey.

White, 2000 Chevrolet van with 'Urban Moving Systems' sign on back seen at Liberty State Park, Jersey City, NJ, at the time of first impact of jetliner into World Trade Center Three individuals with van were seen celebrating after initial impact and subsequent explosion. FBI Newark Field Office requests that, if the van is located, hold for prints and detain individuals. (9)

When a van fitting that exact description was stopped just before crossing into New York, the suspicious "middle-easterners" were apprehended. Imagine the surprise of the police officers when these terror suspects turned out to be Israelis!

According to ABC's 20/20, when the van belonging to the cheering Israelis was stopped by the police, the driver of the van, Sivan Kurzberg, told the officers:

"We are Israelis. We are not your problem. Your problems are our problems. The Palestinians are your problem." (10)

Why did he feel that Palestinians were a problem for the NYPD?

The police and FBI field agents became very suspicious when they found maps of the city with certain places highlighted, box cutters (the same items that the hijackers supposedly used), $4700 cash stuffed in a sock, and foreign passports. [I'd LOVE to know which countries those 'foreign passports were from! -- Alice]. Police also told the Bergen Record that bomb sniffing dogs were brought to the van and that they reacted as if they had smelled explosives. (11)

The FBI seized and developed their photos, one of which shows Sivan Kurzberg flicking a cigarette lighter in front of the smouldering ruins in an apparently celebratory gesture. (12)

The Jerusalem Post later reported that a white van with a bomb was stopped as it approached the George Washington Bridge, but the ethnicity of the suspects was not revealed. Here's what the Jerusalem Post reported on September 12, 2001:

American security services overnight stopped a car bomb on the George Washington Bridge. The van, packed with explosives, was stopped on an approach ramp to the bridge. Authorities suspect the terrorists intended to blow up the main crossing between New Jersey and New York, Army Radio reported. (13)

"...two suspects are in FBI custody after a truckload of explosives was discovered around the George Washington Bridge ... The FBI ... says enough explosives were in the truck to do great damage to the George Washington Bridge."

It was reported the van contained tonnes of explosives.(14)

[Let me get this straight: terrorists caught on 9/11 in Manhattan in a van 'packed with explosives' are LET GO and SENT HOME WITHOUT CHARGE after two months in custody?????? -- Alice]


What's really intriguing is that ABC's 20/20 (15), the New York Post (16), and the New Jersey Bergen Record (17) all clearly and unambiguously reported that a white van with Israelis was intercepted on a ramp near Route 3, which leads directly to the Lincoln Tunnel.

But the Jerusalem Post, Israeli National News (Arutz Sheva) (18 ), and Yediot America, (19) all reported, just as clearly and unambiguously, that a white van with Israelis was stopped on a ramp leading to the George Washington Bridge, which is several miles north of the Lincoln Tunnel.

It appears as if there may actually have been two white vans involved, one stopped on each crossing. This would not only explain the conflicting reports as to the actual location of the arrests, but would also explain how so many credible eye-witnesses all saw celebrating "middle-easterners" in a white van in so many different locations. It also explains why the New York Post and Steve Gordon (lawyer for the 5 Israelis) originally described how three Israelis were arrested but later increased the total to five.

Perhaps one van was meant to drop off a bomb while the other was meant to pick up the first set of drivers while re-crossing back into New Jersey? If a van was to be used as a parked time-bomb on the GW Bridge, then certainly the drivers would need to have a "get-away van" to pick them up and escape. And notice how the van (or vans) stayed away from the third major crossing -the Holland Tunnel- which was where the police had originally been directed to by that anti-Palestinian 9-1-1 "mystery caller". A classic misdirection play.

From there, the story gets becomes even more suspicious. The Israelis worked for a Weehawken moving company known as Urban Moving Systems. An American employee of Urban Moving Systems told the The Record of New Jersey that a majority of his co-workers were Israelis and they were joking about the attacks.

The employee, who declined to give his name said: "I was in tears. These guys were joking and that bothered me." These guys were like, "Now America knows what we go through." (20)

A few days after the attacks, Urban Moving System's Israeli owner, Dominick Suter, dropped his business and fled the country for Israel. He was in such a hurry to flee America that some of Urban Moving System's customers were left with their furniture stranded in storage facilities (21).

Suter's departure was abrupt, leaving behind coffee cups, sandwiches, cell phones and computers strewn on office tables and thousands of dollars of goods in storage. Suter was later placed on the same FBI suspect list as 9/11 lead hijacker Mohammed Atta and other hijackers and suspected al-Qaeda sympathizers, suggesting that U.S. authorities felt Suter may have known something about the attacks. (22)

The Jewish weekly The Forward reported that the FBI finally concluded that at least two of the detained Israelis were agents working for the Mossad, the Israeli intelligence agency, and that Urban Moving Systems, the ostensible employer of the five Israelis, was a front operation. This was confirmed by two former CIA officers, and they noted that movers' vans are a common intelligence cover. (23). The Israelis were held in custody for 71 days before being quietly released. (24)

"There was no question but that [the order to close down the investigation] came from the White House. It was immediately assumed at CIA headquarters that this basically was going to be a cover-up so that the Israelis would not be implicated in any way in 9/11." (25)

Several of the detainees discussed their experience in America on an Israeli talk show after their return home. Said one of the men, denying that they were laughing or happy on the morning of Sept. 11, "The fact of the matter is we are coming from a country that experiences terror daily. Our purpose was to document the event." (26)

How did they know there would be an event to document on 9/11?

It doesn't take Sherlock Holmes to connect the dots of the dancing Israeli Mossad agents - here's the most logical scenario:

1. The Israeli "movers" cheered the 9-11 attacks to celebrate the successful accomplishment of the greatest spy operation ever pulled off in history.

2. One of them, or an accomplice, then calls a 9-1-1 police dispatcher to report Palestinian bomb-makers in a white van headed for the Holland Tunnel.

3. Having thus pre-framed the Palestinians with this phone call, the Israeli bombers then head for the George Washington Bridge instead, where they will drop off their time-bomb van and escape with Urban Moving accomplices.

4. But the police react very wisely and proactively by closing off ALL bridges and tunnels instead of just the Holland Tunnel. This move inadvertently foils the Israelis' misdirection play and leads to their own capture and 40 day torture.

5. To cover up this story, the U.S. Justice Department rounds up over 1000 Arabs for minor immigration violations and places them in New York area jails. The Israelis therefore become less conspicuous as the government and media can now claim that the Israelis were just immigration violators caught in the same dragnet as many other Arabs.

6. After several months, FBI and Justice Department "higher-ups" are able to gradually push aside the local FBI agents and free the Israelis quietly.

Osama bin Laden was immediately blamed for the 9/11 attacks even though he had no previous record of doing anything on this scale. Immediately after the Flight 11 hit World Trade Center 1
CIA Director George Tenet said "You know, this has bin Laden's fingerprints all over it." (27)

The compliant mainstream media completely ignored the Israeli connection. Immediately following the 9-11 attacks the media was filled with stories linking the attacks to bin Laden. TV talking-heads, "experts", and scribblers of every stripe spoon-fed a gullible American public a steady diet of the most outrageous propaganda imaginable.

We were told that the reason bin Laden attacked the USA was because he hates our "freedom" and "democracy". The Muslims were "medieval" and they wanted to destroy us because they envied our wealth, were still bitter about the Crusades, and were offended by Britney Spears shaking her tits and ass all over the place!

But bin Laden strongly denied any role in the attacks and suggested that Zionists orchestrated the 9-11 attacks. The BBC published bin Laden's statement of denial in which he said:

"I was not involved in the September 11 attacks in the United States nor did I have knowledge of the attacks. There exists a government within a government within the United States. The United States should try to trace the perpetrators of these attacks within itself; to the people who want to make the present century a century of conflict between Islam and Christianity. That secret government must be asked as to who carried out the attacks. ... The American system is totally in control of the Jews, whose first priority is Israel, not the United States." (28 )

You never heard that quote on your nightly newscast did you?

[A] number of intelligence officials have raised questions about Osama bin Laden's capabilities. "This guy sits in a cave in Afghanistan and he's running this operation?" one C.I.A. official asked. "It's so huge. He couldn't have done it alone." A senior military officer told me that because of the visas and other documentation needed to infiltrate team members into the United States a major foreign intelligence service might also have been involved. (29)

Bin Laden is not named as the perpetrator of 9/11 by the FBI:

When asked why there is no mention of 9/11 on Bin Laden�s Most Wanted web page (30), [Rex Tomb, Chief of Investigative Publicity for the FBI] said, "The reason why 9/11 is not mentioned on Usama Bin Laden's Most Wanted page is because the FBI has no hard evidence connecting Bin Laden to 9/11. (31)

"So we've never made the case, or argued the case that somehow Osama bin Laden [sic] was directly involved in 9/11. That evidence has never been forthcoming" - Dick Cheney.

[whitehouse.gov]

To date, the only shred of 'evidence' to be uncovered against bin Laden is a barely audible fuzzy amateur video that the Pentagon just happened to find "lying around" in Afghanistan. How very convenient, and how very fake. (32)

There is no evidence, be it hard or circumstantial, to link the Al Qaeda "terrorist network" to these acts of terror, but there is a mountain of evidence, both hard and circumstantial, which suggests that Zionists have been very busy framing Arabs for terror plots against America.

"I think there is very compelling evidence that at least some of the terrorists were assisted not just in financing -- although that was part of it -- by a sovereign foreign government ... It will become public at some point when it's turned over to the archives, but that's 20 or 30 years from now" - Senator Bob Graham. (33)

[If the evidence pointed to the complicity of an Arab or Muslim 'sovereign foreign government', why would it not be made public? After all TWO 'sovereign foreign governments have been brought down and their countries destroyed, millions of people killed, because of the accusation that they were involved in the 9/11 attacks. The U.S. government and media have hardly been shy about publishing information that they claim incriminates even allied Arab governments, such as Saudi Arabia, Yeman or Egypt. Why would such a smoking gun be classified and locked in the vaults for at least 20 or 30 years? Unless the 'sovereign foreign government' is Israel. -- Alice].

If the sovereign foreign government mentioned by Senator Graham was an enemy of the United States the "compelling evidence" would not be kept secret for 20+ years.

One final point; at 09:40 on 9-11 it was reported that the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine claimed responsibility for the attacks (31). This claim was immediately denied by the DFLP leader Qais abu Leila who said it had always opposed "terror attacks on civilian targets, especially outside the occupied territories." (34)

Why would a Palestinian organisation comprising of less than 500 people (35) make the suicidal move of immediately claiming responsibility for the attacks?

Sharon and the other Israeli leaders aspire to fulfill what the goals of the political Zionist movement have been since its origin a century ago: to turn all of historic Palestine into an exclusively Jewish state. A central tenet of the Zionist ideology is expressed in the racist slogan, "A land without people for a people without a land." (36)

The implication of Palestinians in the 9/11 attacks would have handed Zionists a golden opportunity to achieve the above because all Palestinians would have been labeled terrorists.

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/fiveisraelis.html


Israel has a very long history of planning and executing terrible atrocities, not only against its enemies, but even against friendly countries, and then planting false evidence so that Arabs would be blamed. I've posted quite a bit of information about that in previous threads. But if someone is too lazy to look that up, or hasn't yet figured out how to use the Google, I'll be happy to elaborate.

How many facts, how much evidence -- even BESIDES the "dancing Israelis" and the moving vans 'packed with explosives' does a person need to blank out, in order to continue believing that the case for Israel (and its agents) being a prime suspect, even THE prime suspect for the crimes committed on September 11, 2001, is based on nothing more than "anti-semitism"?

(FWIW, I am in general agreement with both hava and c2w about the perps being members of a transnational or meta-group type of 'organisation' -- I just like to be more specific when possible: name names, follow particular evidence trails, that sort of thing. These are above all ruthless CRIMINALS, admittedly criminals with an Israel-fetish, but I believe it's a mistake to ascribe to them loyalty to anyone or anything above their own greedy, sociopathic little selves. It's therefore incredibly exasperating when someone tries to divert attention away from these squirrels based on some misguided idea that even a Jewish criminal responsible for the most heinous crimes is somehow mystically, by definition, a victim ... regardless of the mountains evidence (in this case and in the case of the zionist state) to the contrary or logic or the context).

[American Dream]

AlicetheKurious wrote:

It's fascinating -- and frustrating -- how, time and again, a smokescreen of emotional blackmail rapidly engulfs any rational attempt to analyse the 9/11 attacks as a crime through the framework of the standard questions: 1) "cui bono?" 2) who had the resources to carry out this crime? 3) who had the clear motive? and 4) who was in a position to recognize and exploit the opportunity to carry it off?

Based on these four questions, a specific group of closely inter-related ideological fanatics all linked to Ariel Sharon and Israel's right-wing Likud Party should be at the very top of the list of suspects. They were (per$onally and ideologically) the prime beneficiaries of the attacks, they had the resources to pull it off, they wrote down their motive in black and white prior to the crime and they, after George W. Bush's (s)election in 2000, were in the perfect position to recognize and exploit (if not create) the window of opportunity that allowed the attacks to take place almost without a hitch.

There can be little doubt that the Israeli Government plays a significant role in "black ops" around the planet. There is significant evidence linking Israel to covert assassination, drug trafficking, provocateurism and false flag terrorism, sophisticated psy-ops and mind control etc.

That said, my concern about your presentation, Alice- here and in general, is that you are in danger of over-emphasizing the Israeli role, at the expense of a more complex picture of how deep political power is transacted.

It's rather like the proverbial blind men describing an elephant- the facts may be "true", but they lead to an incomplete and inadequate understanding of the beast, as the complex organism which it is. It's as if saying that the pachyderm is trunk , or mostly trunk, somehow resolves the issue of elephants.



AlicetheKurious wrote:

(FWIW, I am in general agreement with both hava and c2w about the perps being members of a transnational or meta-group type of 'organisation' -- I just like to be more specific when possible: name names, follow particular evidence trails, that sort of thing. These are above all ruthless CRIMINALS, admittedly criminals with an Israel-fetish, but I believe it's a mistake to ascribe to them loyalty to anyone or anything above their own greedy, sociopathic little selves. It's therefore incredibly exasperating when someone tries to divert attention away from these squirrels based on some misguided idea that even a Jewish criminal responsible for the most heinous crimes is somehow mystically, by definition, a victim ... regardless of the mountains evidence (in this case and in the case of the zionist state) to the contrary or logic or the context).

Uncle Sam, still the global hegemon, oversees a global crime family. Within that crime family, Israelis play an important role, but so do Saudis, Pakistanis, and others. It is, I think, a mistake to definitively describe the perpetrators of 9/11 as "criminals with an Israel-fetish". It is however, completely reasonable to assert that there are Israelis in the mix...

[GM Citizen]

And I'm supposed to believe YOU rather than an actual verifiable ABC link? lol

Hey, Unaltered, don't take it from me. Take it from this guy. He was there! Yeah, no way, you say. Yes way. He was there ON TOP of the van with his 4 pals, and guess what he says? He says "our purpose was to document the event". Huh, go figure.

That explains the camcorder, although the reason for the dancing has yet to be determined.

Check out what he says back home in November, 2001:

"our purpose was to document the event"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zx9q5N8iV68

And you believe this means "our purpose was to document the event for Mossad?" Well, obviously you do. I don't know what to say to you now. I certainly don't want to get tied up into an insult fest so I'll just say I'm dumbfounded to find you just may believe that is what he meant.

These guys were there from no later than 16 minutes after it all started. By reliable accounts, 2 of them are Mossad. They go on TV and admit their purpose was to document the event.

Now, who do you think they were documenting the event for?

[unaltered]

[Now, who do you think they were documenting the event for?

Why was anyone who took video that day takng them? People have this strange habit of documenting momentous events, even birthdays, weddings, etc. Do you really believe that Mossad agents go on Israeli tv and confess? Since when?

Of course I suppose he could be one of the losing contestants on that popular Israeli show, "Who Wants To Be A Mossad Agent?"

[GM Citizen]

[Now, who do you think they were documenting the event for?

Why was anyone who took video that day takng them? People have this strange habit of documenting momentous events, even birthdays, weddings, etc. Do you really believe that Mossad agents go on Israeli tv and confess? Since when?

Of course I suppose he could be one of the losing contestants on that popular Israeli show, "Who Wants To Be A Mossad Agent?"

Who do you think these Mossad agents were documenting the WTC attacks for?

[unaltered]

[Now, who do you think they were documenting the event for?

Why was anyone who took video that day takng them? People have this strange habit of documenting momentous events, even birthdays, weddings, etc. Do you really believe that Mossad agents go on Israeli tv and confess? Since when?

Of course I suppose he could be one of the losing contestants on that popular Israeli show, "Who Wants To Be A Mossad Agent?"

Who do you think these Mossad agents were documenting the WTC attacks for?

You sound like a fuckin CIA interrogator. Let me get my snorkel for the next round.