Timothy Leary and Parapolitics

[lightningBugout]

The CIA helped spring Leary from his prison in Algeria, where he'd been consigned by Eldridge Cleaver, who had instantly seen Leary for what he was.. At the time he put him in jail, the exiled information minister of the Black Panthers said, "There's something wrong with Leary's brain. We want people to gather their wits, sober up and get down to the serious business of destroying the Babylonian empire. To all those of you who look to Dr. Leary for inspiration and leadership, we want to say to you that your God is dead, because his mind has been blown by acid." Leary's wife Rosemary didn't want to deal with the CIA agent who sprang them from prison in Algeria. For once Leary was on the mark. "He's liberal CIA," Leary told Rosemary. "And that's the best mafia you can deal with in the 20th century."

Cockburn from counterpunch was on safran on sunday on jjj a few months back debunking 911 as a conspiracy. his argument was crap, and it put me off him, but he did focus almost exclusively on the CD no plane version of 911 truth. None of the juivy stuff.

Cockburn "sybel who?" (I made that up but its the general theme.)

Some people might think thats my view with that buying the official story thread. but its not.

Hearing him is probably part of what motivated me re that thread tho.

I actually sent as much info as I could and a link to the blog and coincidence theorists ... post (safran) and my questions. No response and nothing to address those issues on the interview either.

The entire counter culture revolution was very likely a social engineering project, the result of Project Paperclip.

It probably didn't work as well as they had hoped then.

BTW Chig, if Leary was a dog and thats how he reduced his sentance, that still is no proof he was a spook. If he was a spook he would have been informing on people wherever appropriate anyway. (IMO its never appropriate.)

quick tangent - cockburn's parroting of the false memory syndrome / satanic panic talking points stuns me - might've dismissed it as yet more old-left misogny but the 9/11 party-lining makes me see he's an ass.

[American Dream]

According to Walt Bowart, Tim Leary admitted that he was long surrounded by CIA-linked people, who influenced much of what he did. Indeed, from the beginning of Leary's history with Frank Barron at Kaiser in Oakland, this was the case. Maybe Leary was so intoxicated on that heady sense of mastery and insight that he thought he could beat them at their own game?

Irregardless, he got played....

[Truth4Youth]

According to Walt Bowart, Tim Leary admitted that he was long surrounded by CIA-linked people, who influenced much of what he did. Indeed, from the beginning of Leary's history with Frank Barron at Kaiser in Oakland, this was the case. Maybe Leary was so intoxicated on that heady sense of mastery and insight that he thought he could beat them at their own game?

Irregardless, he got played....

No, if anything Leary played them. From my understanding both Leary and the gov't were interested in "rewiring" the brain through drug use. That said their reasons, motives, and goals were completely different.

[nathan28]

Well worth listening to: "If You Meet Timothy Leary by the Side of the Road"

[teamdaemon]

BTW Chig, if Leary was a dog and thats how he reduced his sentance, that still is no proof he was a spook. If he was a spook he would have been informing on people wherever appropriate anyway.

You're right, Joe--it just makes him a wimpy, self-interested jerk, not worth hero worshipping, and there are millions of those types around, even today.

Sounds like somebody has never had to deal with any serious drug charges before.

I personally think that Leary was mind controlled while he was in prison writing InfoPsychology. "Alien Intelligence" sounds pretty spooky to me. Still, anyone who has ever had a positive LSD experience can appreciate what Timothy Leary was trying to do and also what he did do. Timothy Leary is probably the main reason that normal, non-illuminazi human beings can get LSD today.

In my opinion, somebody who has never taken LSD can't understand the significance of this person. I think almost all of the shit talking about Timothy Leary comes from people who don't understand LSD and are afraid of it. If you think that acid makes you lazy and self-absorbed, that could be just your own experience. Or your friend's, or some person you heard about second hand. Who cares?

I don't think that Leary was a saint in the conventional sense, but I am glad that he did what he did.

[teamdaemon]

Oh yes, for sure, responsible use is a big part of it. I am not entirely against altering ones consciousness to gain some insight, ive spent time in sweat lodges with natives doing peyote. I do however, think one is more of a threat to the PTB when they are of sound mind, healthy body, and drug free and this is how I have tried to live my post teen years, prepareing myself to survive in extreme conditions in the event of a collapse.

Ive seen most of the clinical data you speak of and I agree it is a powerful argument, I have also seen clinical data that says it eats holes in your brain much like XTC does, of course much of it is inconclusive and there is always some sort of silly agenda behind most data anyway. You may be right, I'm open to the argument but strictly on the face of it, I would wager is probably not entirely healthy in all cases.

You are just a fountain of misinformed garbage, aren't you?

Number 1, cannabis is good for your mind and body and prevents cancer. If you can't enjoy it that is your problem, it is not a fault of the cannabis plant.

Number 2, LSD is also good for your brain. This is assuming that you are informed and responsible. You are obviously not, so don't take any LSD. LSD has given the human race many wonderful things, like Alcoholics Anonymous.

Number 3, "holes in your brain" from "XTC" is a blatant lie from the government. In the study that ad campaign came from they used amphetamines instead of MDMA. Know what that means? Ecstasy doesn't put holes in your brain, RITALIN DOES. I guess that explains why everyone in this country is so retarded!

Even Peter Jennings knows that the government lies about ecstasy:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=XjvNCijeYlI

also consider reading this entire site before saying anything else about "drugs"

http://www.maps.org

[Wombaticus Rex]

LSD has given the human race many wonderful things, like Alcoholics Anonymous.

Alcoholics Anonymous was founded in the the 1930s.

Then again, I'm open to retrocausality. How did LSD give the world AA?

[exojuridik]

LSD was used to treat alcoholism in the 1950's - I believe that Cary Grant was one of the most famous patients of this innovative treatment. The drug itself is invaluable in freeing one from the constraints of their ego. Its amazing how much conditioning and programming the ego "I" self is exposed to through the socialization process. Perhaps the biggest lie perpetuated by modernity is the importance and exclusitivity of this narcissitic self. However, my own experiments have shown that some ego is necessary for survival on the "need to make a living in a world of assholes" plane of existance.

[Penguin]

I just have to post this short and quick reply.

You know, if you havent trained physically at all, and you do lets say a hundred squats, with no extra weights, you just might kill your legs. Or at least get hospitalized for the strain the muscular cell damage puts on your kidneys. I know this happened in one high school where they put the newbies thru some squats as part of a fun initiatory thingie.

But you also know that physical exercise is good for you, and makes your body more fit and helps it function correctly. That is, if you build your strength and coordination little by little, listening to what your body says, and where it may be injured and need some massaging, stretching or laying back a little. In short, it requires work and attention. To continue the analogy - if you are predisposed to depression, bipolar manic/depressive, schizophrenic or at risk etc, you should probably avoid psychedelics in many/most cases. Some may be helpful in some mental problems as well - but that should be only under professional care and guidance. If one ignores such conditions, its the same as running with an injured leg, causing further injury ...

Psychedelics are exactly the same. They can very beneficially energize your whole mindbody, help you work thru things and expand your capabilities. But they can also hurt you just like too much physical exercise with too little preparation. That does not make them bad - it just means you need some common sense, some effort put into training yourself in this area, so you can enjoy the benefits. And you have to be prepared to face some injuries - some difficult things brought up from your mind, and to work thru these. In the end, we grow thru facing our fears and difficulties.

When you embark on a journey - know that thats what you are doing, be prepared, and take responsibility - and remember that fear is the mind killer.

I think it really is this simple.

[Penguin]

LSD has given the human race many wonderful things, like Alcoholics Anonymous.

Alcoholics Anonymous was founded in the the 1930s.

Then again, I'm open to retrocausality. How did LSD give the world AA?

I think I read the claim that the founder of AA had taken acid and spoke well of it, I think it was on Wikipedia, the most trusty source of infobits on the interweb

Lemmesee if I can find it...

Ok, here it is!

"Wilson achieved sobriety in 1935 and maintained it throughout his remaining 35 years. Despite the success and notoriety afforded him by the accomplishments and growth of AA under his leadership, he continued to suffer from compulsive behavior and episodes of depression. In 1955 Wilson turned over control of AA to a board of trustees. In the years before his death he changed the makeup of the board, which was initially composed of non-alcoholics, to trustees who were both recovering alcoholics and non-alcoholics. In keeping with his interest in spirituality, he and other early leaders of the movement also considered and experimented with other possible cures for alcoholism. These therapies included niacin (vitamin B3) and LSD as a means of inducing spiritual change.[1] Wilson died of emphysema complicated by pneumonia in 1971. His wife, Lois Wilson, was the founder of Al-Anon, a group dedicated to helping the friends and relatives of alcoholics. In 1999 Time Magazine declared Bill Wilson to be in the top twenty of the Time 100: Heroes and Icons who exemplified "courage, selflessness, exuberance, superhuman ability and amazing grace" in the 20th century.[2]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_W.

I knew I had read that somewhere

[Penguin]

Perhaps the biggest lie perpetuated by modernity is the importance and exclusitivity of this narcissitic self. However, my own experiments have shown that some ego is necessary for survival on the "need to make a living in a world of assholes" plane of existance.

I guess the issue isnt the ego as such - more that the ego supposes its great importance, and becomes a rigid, ignorant dictator all too happily. Maybe making the ego part more willing to change and be more flexible and open to possibilities outside its own field of expertise is what were after?

[Wombaticus Rex]

^^We've veered radically off topic (or, not at all) but hell yeah -- the notion of transcending, eliminating, dissolving the Ego always seemed insanely irresponsible to me, so long and you're still relying on metabolism and respiration for life support. The Ego is very nescessary, you just need to be sure you don't fall for the old "I am my Ego" trick. My Ego has been alternately useful and crippling, but I'm definitely adjusting the balance over the last 5 years or so and making it a more useful, less demanding creature.

As long as we're in these animal bodies, we need that animal Ego.

[nathan28]

^^We've veered radically off topic (or, not at all) but hell yeah -- the notion of transcending, eliminating, dissolving the Ego always seemed insanely irresponsible to me, so long and you're still relying on metabolism and respiration for life support. The Ego is very nescessary, you just need to be sure you don't fall for the old "I am my Ego" trick. My Ego has been alternately useful and crippling, but I'm definitely adjusting the balance over the last 5 years or so and making it a more useful, less demanding creature.

As long as we're in these animal bodies, we need that animal Ego.

The term "ego" when used by folks in spiritual traditions has led to a lot of goddamn misunderstanding. they mean "the illusion of a permanent, separate, unchanging, painless self". but sometimes they mean "sense of identity" or "process of identifying with something" and sometimes they mean "conceit", which is actually a pretty complicated concept

reacting to language about getting rid of the "ego" isn't helpful, since it's a poor word-choice to begin with. that said spiritual processes can be very unpleasant.

it's not like if you go through the process you lose the ability to feed yourself. that happens, but that's from people addicted to concentration states, or practicing damaging mental techniques

to tie it back on-topic it's the confusion over this issue, i believe, that has lead to so many acid casualties. Are they trying to "kill" their ego? Or to expand it? Are they interested in absolute reality (i.e., what is never not present) or are they interested in altered reality? etc. None of those questions seem to get asked, let alone answered, in psychedelic circles

so when you have a Tim Leary, or the CIA, experimenting with LSD, they've never really examined it in terms of those questions either, since it's not clear they even know that those questions exist, and the results are, largely, visible today--nobody really seems to know what to do with this stuff

[exojuridik]

The reason why psychedelic experiences are so different from other states of being is that you can't predict or manpulate how your conscious understanding of yourself will change. At the point where your normal perceptual matrix no longer takes even itself for granted, it becomes possible to understand pure consciousness naked and unadorned by the self-serving illusions we impose on the past and future in an effort to create a sense of continuity for ourselves. By seeking to understand the possibilities present at this transcendant moment, Leary, Liily and RAW were able to explore where no self-respecting spook or psychiatrist could allow themselves to go. Personally, I found the point of the trip with the most long-term profound impact is where you are busy trying to reassemble the constituent pieces of your psyche while "keeping it in your mind, and trying not to forget that it is not he nor she nor them or it that you belong to." but what do I know - I posting of thid site instead of making a respectable upper-middle class income for myself.

[American Dream]

exojuridikwrote:

Leary, Liily and RAW were able to explore where no self-respecting spook or psychiatrist could allow themselves to go.

Leary, Lilly and Wilson's psychedelic experiences were all linked to the spook-world in certain ways, be they direct or indirect. The "Aquarius vs. Pegasus" model of good psychedelic spooks fighting bad ones may explain this, but I rather doubt it. Instead, it seems much more likely that psychedelics were in circulation in the 50's and early 60's due in part to a Cold War milieu, and that people who latched on to the experience were subject to cooptation by the powers-that-be.

This does not mean that these people weren't having powerful experiences, nor that they didn't believe in spreading the psychedelic gospel, but rather that others in the milieu may have been pursuing other agenda, for which they found these sorts of people somehow useful...