An idea about Palestine/Israel

[FourthBase]

last I checked no stakeholders were accepting suggestions from the peanut gallery.

You never know, stakeholders might be willing to listen.

I agree though that the time has come to settle this matter, in any way possible. At the least the Palestinians need to be relocated to somewhere minimally habitable and out of range. It's almost unbelievable the conditions they endure presently.

Right, no matter what side one is on, Palestinian relocation as a premise might be worth considering. Doesn't matter if it's perceived as an exile or an escape.

[Occult Means Hidden]

That would solve it? You think the violence and wars would end after that?

Sure, it would stop eventually. As far as the reason for hating Israel would no longer exist.

But of course, Israel won't ever concede, so the excuse to continue the violence, carries on.

[FourthBase]

If what you say is right -- the crisis is all about Palestinians who want to deny Jews something, and nothing one could provide them will make that go away -- then yeah that would comprise a crippling hole in the idea. I think it's about more than that, however.

I'd hope to be wrong. I don't think I am, though.

For what it's worth, there's a very similar plan advertising for subscribers now and again in the 'Jerusalem Post'. It's a privately funded plan intended to raise money to settle Palestinians in (IIRC) Jordan or Egypt, where they would eventually become citizens.

Get the fuck out, really? I had zero expectation of the idea having a precedent. But I guess my idea has the more unconventional twist of Palestinians viewing a new destination as the new Palestine, a new nation just like Israel had been for Jews, not just a place to emigrate and be absorbed into an already existing nation. Or is that part of the plan too? Regardless, I'm relieved to see that something similar is being talked about, even marginally, by people there. Could you perhaps link me to it, or just post the group's name?

[FourthBase]

That would solve it? You think the violence and wars would end after that?

Sure, it would stop eventually. As far as the reason for hating Israel would no longer exist.

But of course, Israel won't ever concede, so the excuse to continue the violence, carries on.

Right, one or the other will never concede. Hence this idea.

[Occult Means Hidden]

The Palestinians leaving their lands, allows Israel to annex their land completely. This isn't a compromise. Even if they are paid off. And why couldn't Israeli settler's be paid to move back to Israel? Why have the Palestinians paid to move?

[Penguin]

Right, please...so STFU, please? I mean that nicely. I know it'll wind up going there anyway, but I'd like to forestall that as long as possible. Thanks.

Sure, no problem mate I just had to say that...
(this idea just reminds me of an idea to create a homeland for a certain people, whom a certain other people at certain other time felt needed to be removed from their midst...You know what Im saying..)

[massen]

Since when do Americans say 'bonkers'?

Not suggesting anyone should go there but isn't there loads of space in Australia? Or is it full of weird outback psycho killers?

[Penguin]

It is. Theyre called Australians, descendants of the murderers, other criminals, and probably political dissidents, shipped there to the great delight of the aboriginals, by the brits. Long live the Queen!

[orz]

If the actual issue were that the Palestinians lacked a place to call their own, it'd be a wonderful plan. In that case, though, original partition would have served, and we'd not be having this discussion. The actual issue is the anti-semitism of the Palestinians and the Arabs, and their desire to prevent the Jews from having a place of their own.

Yes but I'm sure we can at least have a whip-round to relocate you and your terribly feeble and boring troll posts far away in a sparsely-populated land, you worthless moron.

[FourthBase]

The Palestinians leaving their lands, allows Israel to annex their land completely. This isn't a compromise. Even if they are paid off. And why couldn't Israeli settler's be paid to move back to Israel? Why have the Palestinians paid to move?

- It's land, not life. Life > land. Annex away, that's the entire point.

Like, this would be the mentality the idea would seek to appeal: "You want our land so badly? Fine, buy us out and you can take it. Meanwhile we're going to go ahead and do what you guys should have done. Our lives, our culture, our freedom...it's all more important than land, infinitely more important than our desire to stay in one place, no matter how much of a right we have to it. We're the new you. Or should we say, the old you. Either way, we're better than you right now. And you're no better than the monsters who wanted to extinguish you."

Not that I feel that way, but that Palestinians might.

- The idea would be to pay them off almost excessively, giving them a start to a far better life. Again, not talking about what's just, just what would work. It's not a compromise, right -- it would only work as a sales pitch. It would only work if the Palestinians involved agreed to it, if they wanted it almost as much as (if not more than) what they currently want.

- Israeli settlers have no conceivable grievance about being invaded, or persecuted. They're the ones on the offensive, no matter what anyone thinks of their justifications. And the money would come from the massive Israeli military budget, and so there's no way the Israelis would pay settlers to back off, obviously.

By the way: One crucial condition would be that the money would have to be supervised and directed so that none of it could ever find its way into terrorist hands. Even though such a thing would be hard to imagine given how much corruption exists in the world, it's gotta be possible somehow. Same goes for any other shady scenario. Yes, evil could undermine the idea, like it could anything, but I'm still just looking at the idea in a kind of evil-free vacuum.

[FourthBase]

Right, please...so STFU, please? I mean that nicely. I know it'll wind up going there anyway, but I'd like to forestall that as long as possible. Thanks.

Sure, no problem mate I just had to say that...
(this idea just reminds me of an idea to create a homeland for a certain people, whom a certain other people at certain other time felt needed to be removed from their midst...You know what Im saying..)

Yup, I mentioned it already. Madagascar, right? Or the Indians, here?

[chiggerbit]

chiggerbit wrote:
I have a better suggestion. In the first place, the Jews should have been given the entire country of Germany after WWll for compensation. It isn't too late. Offer either the Israelis a piece of Germany for every Israili. Or, if they collectively decide that they don't want it, divide it between the Palestinians. Problem solved.

4thb wrote:
Great sentiment, but even if my idea is unfeasible it still poses a neutral and relatively open destination for a new Palestine, like Uganda had been for Jews who weren't obsessed with Israel being located in its original place. Also, practically speaking, Germany would just be another frying pan -- sure many Germans might be willing to sacrifice room to satisfy their collective guilty feelings, but there are still a shitload of virulent racists there who'd attack either group of semites.

Humph, the Israelis know how to deal with that. Besides, those are the very people who deserve to be treated the way the Israelis have been treating the Palestinians.

[FourthBase]

Humph, the Israelis know how to deal with that. Besides, those are the very people who deserve to be treated the way the Israelis have been treating the Palestinians.

Good point. That would make an awesome reality show. "The Is-Real World. What happens when neo-Nazis stop hating from far away, and start living in Israel."

[Sepka]

Get the fuck out, really? I had zero expectation of the idea having a precedent. But I guess my idea has the more unconventional twist of Palestinians viewing a new destination as the new Palestine, a new nation just like Israel had been for Jews, not just a place to emigrate and be absorbed into an already existing nation. Or is that part of the plan too? Regardless, I'm relieved to see that something similar is being talked about, even marginally, by people there. Could you perhaps link me to it, or just post the group's name?

http://www.jerusalemsummit.org/eng/hs_short_eng.htm

It's very much a proposal to allow Palestinians to be assimilated into existing nations. The ultra short version is that any family that agrees gets resettled somewhere, and given a fairly substantial allocation of money. The Palestinians obviously benefit, but the host communities get an influx of newly wealthy immigrants buying land, starting businesses, etc, so everyone comes out ahead. It's resettlement and economic aid all in one.

[kenoma]

It's completely screwy

Okay, and I can obviously see why it might be since it's my idea, but...why?

You don't deserve anything more than the answer I gave you. What you are proposing is ethnic cleansing. If you were talking about any group of people other than the Palestinians, you'd have been banned from most political forums already.