Federal Reserve losing control

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Postby vigilant » Mon Sep 15, 2008 7:31 pm

Antiaristo,

Ok after looking at that list of nations I was somewhat familiar with the fact that there were other countries under the umbrella. I guess I thought you meant larger and more powerful countries. It really doesn't surprise me to see those countries on the list, except for canada.


One of my last lingering questions, for now anyway, concerns the physical ties and methods used by the Crown to tie itself to our financial industry.

I understood years ago "what" was happening, which was a consolidation of power and wealth. After I figured it all out I assumed it was being done strictly by our own government.

You said the power behind it all was the Crown. I"m wondering now through exactly what means they attached themselves to our Federal Reserve, because I am assuming they would have to have control over, or be in collusion with, the Fed?

Clinton was knighted wasn't he? He repealed Glass Stegall and let the wolves in the house on purpose. Greenspan and Bush too right?

You mentined charitable trusts, are they the means by which the Crown stuck its tentacles into the Fed, or whatever, or however it is they got so deeply buried into our financial scene?
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Postby barracuda » Wed Sep 17, 2008 4:14 pm

http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ ... 3605.story

Bernanke: 'We have lost control'

Economist recounts talk with Fed chairman

By Joshua Boak | Chicago Tribune reporter
September 17, 2008

NAPLES, Fla. — Several months ago, economist David Hale had a private meeting with Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke, who was trying to ward off a recession by lowering interest rates and increasing the money supply in the economy.

The problem with that approach is that the value of the dollar plunged against foreign currencies, causing crude oil prices to skyrocket because oil is pegged to the dollar. It affected food prices, gasoline and family budgets.

"Ben, you are playing a very unique role in world economic history," Hale recalled telling Bernanke, an expert in the Great Depression. "You are the first central bank governor of the United States to preside over a recession with no decline in commodity prices."

Bernanke could hypothetically limit inflation in commodities by raising interest rates, a policy that would restrict the flow of money but potentially lead to an avalanche of bank failures. At a financial conference in Florida on Tuesday, Hale, a Chicago-based economist for investment managers, hedge funds and multinational companies, paraphrased the Fed chairman's response.

"We have lost control," said Hale, quoting Bernanke. "We cannot stabilize the dollar. We cannot control commodity prices."
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Postby antiaristo » Wed Sep 17, 2008 4:29 pm

.

Hi madeupname,

Have you noticed there are no "real" lawyers there?

It's just not worth it to them.

The lawyers know that the UK is a monarchy, not a democracy. The lawyers know that the country has been going backwards for decades.

Here's a quote from Monbiot today:


In the past few days, Sheffield Wednesday Football Club has dropped its cases against some of its fans. I am now allowed to write about the worst example of legal bullying I have ever seen.

The club has had serious problems, on and off the pitch, and many of its fans use an internet forum - owlstalk.co.uk - to discuss them. They make the kind of comments you would expect to find on any talk board, and which would normally be forgotten within 15 minutes. Two and half years ago the club launched its first suit. Only now have the people who posted these comments emerged blinking from the labyrinthine nightmare of English law.

As Geoffrey Robertson and Andrew Nicol explain in their excellent book, Media Law, England's defamation laws date back to a statute created in 1275. The criminal offence of scandalum magnatum was devised to protect "the great men of the realm" from stories which could stir the people against them. Three centuries later, the Star Chamber allowed noblemen to launch civil actions for libel, to provide them with an alternative to duelling.

They made prolific use of this privilege until Fox's Libel Act of 1792 determined that the claimant (the person bringing the case) had to prove that the words used against him were false, malicious and damaging. This means that libel law 216 years ago was more liberal and more in tune with the principle of free speech than it is today.

During the 19th and 20th centuries, Robertson and Nicol show, "the common law was re-fashioned to serve the British class system from the perspective of ... the Victorian club". To protect wealthy people from criticism, the courts reversed Fox's burden of proof. They created a presumption that any derogatory remark made about a gentleman must be false. This remains the case today. Defamation differs from all other civil or criminal laws in Britain: the burden of proof is on the defendant.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... h.medialaw

I don't see any solution coming from within the country.

The solution will come only when external powers are no longer willing to accept the English Court as trustworthy, and London loses its place in worldwide finance.

........

Hi vigilant,
Each of those countries has standing, and a vote, at the UN.
The Commonwealth as a whole, which nearly always votes as a block, holds one in four of the votes at the UN General Assembly.

The Crown is able to legally allow criminal conduct within the City of London. That's one powerful attraction to the people at the top of the banks.

That crime creates lots of money for the participants. I'll cite two. Laundering drug money (legally). Securitizing mortgages through charitable trusts (so there is no comeback on the sponsoring bank).

The role of the US Gov is passive, by acts of omission. Here's an example from the Lloyds fraud:


In the U.S. the staff of the sec wanted to proceed with both of its inquiries. However, they were stopped abruptly in 1992 by the Commission itself, led by Chairman Richard Breeden, not long after British Prime Minister John Major spent a weekend with President George Bush at Camp David. Had Major persuaded Bush to call off the investigation, as British press reports speculated at the time? Both Bush and Major, through spokesmen, say they don't recall discussing Lloyd's. Former Chairman Breeden, who had been a key White House aide under Bush, told Time that the sec decision against proceeding "was not because Mr. Major and Mr. Bush said anything to each other" but because the SEC decided that disputes between Names and Lloyd's should be resolved in English courts. "We didn't make a judgment that the way (Lloyd's) allocated risks among syndicates wasn't sleazy," Breeden told Time. "We didn't make a judgment that their practices were honest."

http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board/v ... 1430#81430

and from further down that thread:


Although the links between the Windsors and the Walker-Bush clan go back at least to the 1920s, the roots of this present crisis can be found in events in 1992.


June 6-8, 1992
Prime Minister John Major
United Kingdom
Met with President Bush during a private visit to Washington, and Camp David (Maryland).

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ho/15738.htm

1/8/03 HYPERLINK "http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/wire/sns-ap-obit-mcclendon0108jan08,0,6212268.story" \t "_blank"

White House Reporter Sarah McClendon Dies

"If the people were to ever find out what we have done, we would be chased down the streets and lynched." -- George Bush, cited in the June, 1992 Sarah McClendon Newsletter

http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board/v ... 308#155308



the SEC decided that disputes between Names and Lloyd's should be resolved in English courts.



And of course, who is it that controls the English courts??????
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Postby nathan28 » Wed Sep 17, 2008 4:34 pm

barracuda wrote:http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-wed_oilsep17,0,4833605.story

Bernanke: 'We have lost control'

"Ben, you are playing a very unique role in world economic history," Hale recalled telling Bernanke, an expert in the Great Depression. "You are the first central bank governor of the United States to preside over a recession with no decline in commodity prices."


Whoops! So much for that. Oil down over 40%? Rice and wheat down? Gold down until today's safe haven flight? Still sounds like deflation to me.
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Dodd let's cat out of the bag

Postby isachar » Wed Sep 17, 2008 4:41 pm

This is breathtaking. Essentially, the FED, an unregulated organization with no effective oversight from anyone, will be able to sweep up all the assets of the failed institutions and re-allocate (sell, auction, dispose, transfer) them to anyone it sees fit.

So, here we have the trick exposed. Sweep it all up, stick the taxpayers with the trash, and give out the morsels to your buddies at a garage sale at whatever price terms the FED sees fit.

This is NOT a reprise of the RTC. The RTC had oversight and accountability. The FED has no effective oversight.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid= ... refer=home

Dodd Says the Fed Has Authority to Set Up Debt Fund (Update1)

By Viola Gienger

Sept. 17 (Bloomberg) -- Senate Banking Committee Chairman Christopher Dodd said the Federal Reserve has the authority to act as an ``effective Resolution Trust Fund'' to buy up and dispose of bad debt stemming from the subprime mortgage crisis.

``The Fed has the authority to move in this area,'' Dodd told reporters in Washington today.

Creating a separate agency to take on bad debt, akin to the Resolution Trust Corp. set up in 1989 to absorb losses from savings and loan associations, would take about a year, he said. Instead, the Fed should use its own authority to act.

``Debating whether or not you're going to set up some new agency or bureaucracy in government is a nice point but I don't think we have the luxury of waiting another year,'' Dodd said.

Establishing a new government bureaucracy might distract officials from addressing housing as the underlying cause of the financial crisis, Dodd said. Congress in July enacted legislation creating a Federal Housing Administration program to insure as much as $300 billion in refinanced mortgages for 400,000 borrowers at risk of losing their homes.

Implementing regulations based on that legislation will help, as will lower mortgage rates and the government's takeover of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac earlier this month, Dodd said.

``But candidly, I want to do a lot more than 400,000 units,'' he said. ``And we have the opportunity to do more than that.''

Dodd met yesterday with Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke and Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson and said Bernanke agreed that the subprime mortgage collapse remains the core of the broader crisis.

For the longer term, Dodd said he's ``willing to entertain'' the idea of a separate agency.

To contact the reporter on this story: Viola Gienger in Washington at vgienger@bloomberg.net.

Last Updated: September 17, 2008 14:36 EDT
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Postby vigilant » Wed Sep 17, 2008 6:50 pm

They just poisoned wall street so they could buy it for pennies on the dollar. Scraped up tons of real estate and mortages in the mortage debacle at the same time.

And they bought it with money they don't even have. With Fractional Reserve Banking, you have one trillion, pretend to have ten trillion, and buy stuff up with worthless receipts that say, "we got money".

With fractional reserve banking too, if you can get a sucker to borrow your fantasy dollars you don't even have in the first place, they are now on the hook to pay it back with "real cash dollars". So in essence you trade pieces of paper for "real cash dollars" plus interest you charge them for the privelage of letting you fuck them blind.

Its nice to be a banker. If for some reason they don't give you "real cash dollars" for the money you never loaned them in the first place, you get to have the pleasure of having your armed thugs go get em and beat em up, take their stuff, and put em in jail too.

Think about that. Pretend you have ten times the money you really have. Loan it out. Now those poor saps have to bring you real cash dollars in return, and you get to charge them interest too.

If your family has been playing that game for several generations, it doesn't take long to be a multi trillionaire ya know....think about the power of compound interest. When you hear them say, "we only got enough money for this or that"...its horse shit for sure......

I don't know how accurate this is. But this is supposed to be the flow chart on the Fed ownership. http://land.netonecom.net/tlp/ref/federal_reserve.shtml


N.M. Rothschild , London - Bank of England
______________________________________
| |
| J. Henry Schroder
| Banking | Corp.
| |
Brown, Shipley - Morgan Grenfell - Lazard - |
& Company & Company Brothers |
| | | |
--------------------| -------| | |
| | | | | |
Alex Brown - Brown Bros. - Lord Mantagu - Morgan et Cie -- Lazard ---|
& Son | Harriman Norman | Paris Bros |
| | / | N.Y. |
| | | | | |
| Governor, Bank | J.P. Morgan Co -- Lazard ---|
| of England / N.Y. Morgan Freres |
| 1924-1938 / Guaranty Co. Paris |
| / Morgan Stanley Co. | /
| / | \Schroder Bank
| / | Hamburg/Berlin
| / Drexel & Company /
| / Philadelphia /
| / /
| / Lord Airlie
| / /
| / M. M. Warburg Chmn J. Henry Schroder
| | Hamburg --------- marr. Virginia F. Ryan
| | | grand-daughter of Otto
| | | Kahn of Kuhn Loeb Co.
| | |
| | |
Lehman Brothers N.Y -------------- Kuhn Loeb Co. N. Y.
| | --------------------------
| | | |
| | | |
Lehman Brothers - Mont. Alabama Solomon Loeb Abraham Kuhn
| | __|______________________|_________
Lehman-Stern, New Orleans Jacob Schiff/Theresa Loeb Nina Loeb/Paul Warburg
- ------------------------- | | |
| | Mortimer Schiff James Paul Warburg
_____________|_______________/ |
| | | | |
Mayer Lehman | Emmanuel Lehman \
| | | \
Herbert Lehman Irving Lehman \
| | | \
Arthur Lehman \ Phillip Lehman John Schiff/Edith Brevoort Baker
/ | Present Chairman Lehman Bros
/ Robert Owen Lehman Kuhn Loeb - Granddaughter of
/ | George F. Baker
| / |
| / |
| / Lehman Bros Kuhn Loeb (1980)
| / |
| / Thomas Fortune Ryan
| | |
| | |
Federal Reserve Bank Of New York |
|||||||| |
______National City Bank N. Y. |
| | |
| National Bank of Commerce N.Y ---|
| | \
| Hanover National Bank N.Y. \
| | \
| Chase National Bank N.Y. \
| |
| |
Shareholders - National City Bank - N.Y. |
- ----------------------------------------- |
| /
James Stillman /
Elsie m. William Rockefeller /
Isabel m. Percy Rockefeller /
William Rockefeller Shareholders - National Bank of Commerce N. Y.
J. P. Morgan -----------------------------------------------
M.T. Pyne Equitable Life - J.P. Morgan
Percy Pyne Mutual Life - J.P. Morgan
J.W. Sterling H.P. Davison - J. P. Morgan
NY Trust/NY Edison Mary W. Harriman
Shearman & Sterling A.D. Jiullard - North British Merc. Insurance
| Jacob Schiff
| Thomas F. Ryan
| Paul Warburg
| Levi P. Morton - Guaranty Trust - J. P. Morgan
|
|
Shareholders - First National Bank of N.Y.
- -------------------------------------------
J.P. Morgan
George F. Baker
George F. Baker Jr.
Edith Brevoort Baker
US Congress - 1946-64
|
|
|
|
|
Shareholders - Hanover National Bank N.Y.
- ------------------------------------------
James Stillman
William Rockefeller
|
|
|
|
|
Shareholders - Chase National Bank N.Y.
- ---------------------------------------
George F. Baker
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Postby kenoma » Wed Sep 17, 2008 7:39 pm

China paper urges new currency order after "financial tsunami"


BEIJING (Reuters) - Threatened by a "financial tsunami," the world must consider building a financial order no longer dependent on the United States, a leading Chinese state newspaper said on Wednesday.

The commentary in the overseas edition of the People's Daily said the collapse of Lehman Brothers Holdings Inc (NYSE:LEH - News) "may augur an even larger impending global 'financial tsunami'."

The People's Daily is the official newspaper of China's ruling Communist Party, and the overseas edition is a smaller circulation offshoot of the main paper.

Its pronouncements do not necessarily directly reflect leadership views, but this commentary by a professor at Shanghai's Tongji University suggested considerable official alarm at the strains buckling world financial markets.

China's central bank earlier this week cut its lending rate for the first time in six years, a move analysts said was aimed at bolstering the economy and the battered stock market.

"The eruption of the U.S. sub-prime crisis has exposed massive loopholes in the United States' financial oversight and supervision," writes the commentator, Shi Jianxun.

"The world urgently needs to create a diversified currency and financial system and fair and just financial order that is not dependent on the United States."

But Vice Premier Wang Qishan, on a visit to the United States, told U.S. trade officials in a meeting on Tuesday that China and the United States needed to maintain close economic ties with global markets going through such turbulence.

"The Chinese government is well aware of the fact that the United States, which is the world's largest developed country, and China, which is the world's largest developing country, should have constructive and cooperative economic and trade relations," he said.

China is a major buyer of U.S. Treasury bonds, and through its sovereign wealth fund it has taken stakes in two large U.S. financial institutions.

In July 2005, China revalued the yuan and freed it from a dollar peg to float within managed bands. But the yuan and China's trade remains tightly linked to the fortunes of the dollar.

The commentary suggested China must brace for grave economic fallout and look to alternatives, saying the crisis brings to mind the Great Depression of the 1930s.

"Lehman Brothers announced bankruptcy will not only have a domino effect on the global financial world, it will bring a shock to the world economy," the front-page comment stated.

http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/080916/financial_china_usa.html?.v=1
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Postby vigilant » Wed Sep 17, 2008 9:18 pm

The last major financial stepping stone in this game was the internet bubble collapse of 2000 and it was part of the set up for this stepping stone we see now. I"m trying to put my peepers on the next stepping stone but I can't see it yet...its there, its still in the fog though...

I can't tell if this "was the goal", meaning to buy Wall Street for pennies on the dollar and let the taxpayers pay the tab, and consolidate banking power on a global scale....or if this is only a means to "another end". Since the game never really ends, of course its a stepping stone, but to "what"? Don't forget these things often take years in between, and sometimes they come in triplicate real fast one right after the other....so who knows....

I'd say the main goal was some sort of takeover. Some of the players just whacked by some of their competitors and we have had a major shift in the pecking order, of some sort. I don't just mean the names we have been hearing either. I'd say the real power are mostly names we never even heard of before in many cases. A lot of the names we are familiar with are bagmen for their bosses, whom remain unknown because they like it that way.

Beyond that, if its a means to another end, I think it could well be the one we have all suspected, and discussed on and off for a long time. Which is standardizing the currency in several countries. The power that would bring to the controllers of that currency would be enormous I would think...unless there is a hidden downside I'm not seeing.

We know one thing, the same NWO Bush Sr. and Jr. have been incessantly talking about just flopped its fat hiney in our lap. This is like running the flag up the flag pole in my opinion and saying, "We have arrived, see us in our glory." Some of the headlines and comments in the articles the press is putting out indicate that I believe. I cited one below as an example.

While the population sees this as one of those disasters that "just" happen somehow, I am viewing it as a victory of large measure for its makers. I believe somewhere they are sitting in their $30,000.00 leather reclining chairs, wearing their $5000.00 silk smoking jackets, drinking $100,000 dollar a bottle wine, and they are toasting each other with smug faces, and discussing this most "brilliant" move on their part. They are also cackling about how the more "vulgar" among us still don't even realize it...


headline from a bloomberg article yesterday...

Bloomberg: ‘New Financial World Order’ As Lehman Fails, Merrill Sold
Thats a statement right there. It is.....thats a declaration.



snippets from the article in the post before this one...

"Lehman Brothers announced bankruptcy will not only have a domino effect on the global financial world, it will bring a shock to the world economy," the front-page comment stated.

Lehman was a major family in the world order of the financial hierarchy and so was Morgan Stanley. (I know the article above says Merrill but i'm talking about M. Stanley.) If you look at the chart of how the Fed organization is organized from the top down they are "major" players. These 2 were not just bit players that got bumped out, or promoted which is very possible, and I have no idea which, but they moved on the board somehow. That could be considered a move in the order, but I have a feeling the NWO means much more than that too.



"The world urgently needs to create a diversified currency and financial system and fair and just financial order that is not dependent on the United States."

There has been a lot of talk that the international banksters that have no loyalty and have control over more than one country are knocking the U.S. off the pole position in some way, in order to consolidate their power more broadly. Not sayin the above snippet proves anything, just an example of the verbage i'm seeing all over the place...



building a financial order

There is a major reshuffling going on. I'm not going to be surprised at all if this leads to a situation that puts the population in some sort of financial distress, and the source of relief will be to go and swap your dollars for some sort of new currency so that you can get your life back. Classic problem-reaction-solution style...

They don't even have an order without us. We are what makes an order in the first place. We are the bricks and mortar of the order. I don't know what they have planned for the bricks yet, but i'm lookin.....
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Postby freemason9 » Wed Sep 17, 2008 9:59 pm

nathan28 wrote:
barracuda wrote:http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-wed_oilsep17,0,4833605.story

Bernanke: 'We have lost control'

"Ben, you are playing a very unique role in world economic history," Hale recalled telling Bernanke, an expert in the Great Depression. "You are the first central bank governor of the United States to preside over a recession with no decline in commodity prices."


Whoops! So much for that. Oil down over 40%? Rice and wheat down? Gold down until today's safe haven flight? Still sounds like deflation to me.


Commodity prices are actually being depressed now, nathan. Think long and hard about that. This is the beginning of the second phase.
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Postby freemason9 » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:03 pm

And for those of you that believe this was planned, and that this is all part of some grand conspiracy to establish a NWO, you couldn't be further from the truth. The fact is that there are idiots at the top, and they got there because they were well-connected to other idiots.

That, my friends, is the way of the world. Sometimes it is hard to imagine just how incompetent leadership is.
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Postby DrVolin » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:16 pm

freemason9 wrote:Sometimes it is hard to imagine just how incompetent leadership is.


And as long as you keep thinking that, they'll have a free hand.
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Postby freemason9 » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:22 pm

DrVolin wrote:
freemason9 wrote:Sometimes it is hard to imagine just how incompetent leadership is.


And as long as you keep thinking that, they'll have a free hand.


And as long as you keep thinking they are superhuman, you are already defeated.
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Postby Wilbur Whatley » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:38 pm

FWIW, I side with freemason9 on that last dispute.

Although it is ripping my retirement accounts to shreds, I hope this collapse drives the DJIA all the way to 5000 in the next two weeks, guaranteeing an Obama presidency.

By the way, it is just really amazing, even in these bizarro times, that George W. Bush, who is supposed to be the President of the United States, has not addressed the nation during the catastrophic market collapse this week. That says so many things.
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Postby vigilant » Wed Sep 17, 2008 10:50 pm

freemason9 wrote:
DrVolin wrote:
freemason9 wrote:Sometimes it is hard to imagine just how incompetent leadership is.


And as long as you keep thinking that, they'll have a free hand.


And as long as you keep thinking they are superhuman, you are already defeated.


Not super human, just willing to kill ya for what ya got.
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Postby smiths » Wed Sep 17, 2008 11:38 pm

yeah its ridiculous to think its planned and some sort of conspiracy

its just a repeated pattern of incompetence and stupidity that happens to keep increasing the power and wealth of a handful of interconnected individuals at the expense of 99.999999% of the worlds poulation
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