'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby justdrew » Wed Jun 09, 2010 10:49 am

DoYouEverWonder wrote:
justdrew wrote:I'm now officially worried that something is causing underground deposits to experience increased pressure levels, across the globe. There've been like at least three natural gas well accidents/problems in the last week and a half, the north sea well problem, and now one or two more rigs in the gulf seeming to be leaking a bit.

Apparently this has been happening on a fairly regular basis. We're just hearing more about it now.


yeah, maybe that's all it is...

and another one:
Blast in Texas Panhandle kills 2, injures 3
The Associated Press
Tuesday, June 8, 2010; 9:05 PM

DARROUZETT, Texas -- A Texas Panhandle sheriff says two people are dead from a natural gas pipeline explosion.

Lipscomb County Sheriff James Robertson said in a news release Tuesday that the men were killed shortly after the blast in a remote part of the region.

Three people were injured. One was taken by helicopter to a hospital in Oklahoma City. Two others working near the explosion had injuries not considered life-threatening.

The five men were moving clay from a pit near the pipeline when a bulldozer struck it, causing the explosion.

The blast about 270 miles northeast of Lubbock is the second natural gas line explosion in Texas in as many days.
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby brekin » Wed Jun 09, 2010 12:40 pm

Even more alarming, the rig survivors said, was the amount of resistance the well was giving them. "We had problems with it from the day we got on," Matthew Jacobs said.
There was always like an ominous feeling. This well did not want to be drilled.
--Rig survivor Daniel Barron III

Nearly every day, Jacobs said, "we had problems with that well."

Barron said it was like an eerie cloud hung over the well being dug 5,000 feet into the sea.

"There was always like an ominous feeling," he said. "This well did not want to be drilled. ... It just seemed like we were messing with Mother Nature."


http://edition.cnn.com/2010/US/06/08/oi ... tml?hpt=T2
Rig survivors: BP ordered shortcut on day of blast
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby chiggerbit » Wed Jun 09, 2010 5:36 pm

justdrew wrote:
I'm now officially worried that something is causing underground deposits to experience increased pressure levels, across the globe. There've been like at least three natural gas well accidents/problems in the last week and a half, the north sea well problem, and now one or two more rigs in the gulf seeming to be leaking a bit.


http://www.aapg.org/explorer/2002/11nov/rift_zone.cfm

Gulf's Evolution Makes the Shakes
View Enlargement of Rift Zone Map
Graphics courtesy of Jack Reed
The New Madrid seismic zone in Missouri has long intrigued scientists because, according to conventional geologic theory, large earthquakes clustered in a tectonically quiet region are difficult to understand.

But at least one AAPG member is challenging the crowd.

New Orleans independent geologist Jack M. Reed believes the origin of the earthquakes lies beneath the Gulf of Mexico.

That's not all.

Reed, a retired Texaco geologist-geophysicist who has been studying the region's geology for over 40 years, says the accepted theory of a quiet geologic evolution of the Gulf of Mexico Basin is fundamentally flawed and needs to be revised.

According to him, the Gulf was and is tectonically active -- and it is the likely origin for not only the New Madrid seismic activity, but also for the Middleton Place-Summerville seismic zone near Charleston, S.C.

"For all the years I have worked the Gulf of Mexico Basin I have been forced to accept the 'passive' Gulf formation theory, which holds that the only movement in the basin is updip sedimentary loading that moved the salt southward," Reed said. "But there is little evidence to support this theory, and it doesn't fit what is observed geologically or geophysically.

"As Hugh Wilson said (1993), 'It would be geologically unusual for such a large basin as the Gulf of Mexico to remain almost tectonically undisturbed for 170 million years while major orogenic disturbances repeatedly struck bordering areas.'"

Reed, over the years, has gathered evidence that supports plate motion in the Gulf basin. Thick salt and sedimentary sequences in the basin mask this tectonic motion, but there is enough basin and peripheral evidence to show plate readjustment is occurring -- evidence, he says, in the form of volcanics, earthquakes and rift zones that are accompanied by magnetic, refraction, seismic and gravity data.
Questions? Answers!

One piece of this evidence, according to Reed, is the apparent connection of the New Madrid seismic zone with the Gulf rift features to the south.

"This northeast trending earthquake zone appears to connect with the northeast trending Monroe Uplift, the LaSalle Arch and, possibly, to an active seismic zone located in and around Sabine Lake on the Texas-Louisiana border," he said.


This complex of doming and seismic centers is similar to another Cretaceous age triple juncture located in the northeastern Gulf of Mexico Basin. Doming of the DeSoto Canyon High during the Jurassic to Cretaceous created this triple juncture, which includes the Cretaceous Shelf Edge, the Suwannee Strait and the West Florida Escarpment.

If the New Madrid seismic zone is indeed part of a triple juncture, he continued, there should be an expression of this limb trending along a line in a northeast direction.

So Reed conducted a study using data from the U.S. Geological Survey's National Earthquake Information Center and the USGS map "Earthquakes in the Conterminous United States." He only studied earthquakes measuring at least magnitude 5, and found that while most of the earthquake centers are random with no alignment, there is a well-defined earthquake trend extending northeastward from the New Madrid seismic zone across the United States to Canada, where it joins with the St. Lawrence River seismic zone.

Within the boundaries of this earthquake alignment there are:
Sixty-one seismic points that have a magnitude of 5 and greater.
Several large earthquakes dating to the early 1800s, all measuring over magnitude 8, all occurring within a couple of months of each other, all centered in a northeast trending line.
The two 5+ earthquakes that occurred earlier this year in northern New York state and southern Indiana.

"There is definitely some form of movement occurring along this trend," Reed said, "and it appears to be active today."

As he continued that trend south of New Madrid he found that it was in line with the Monroe Uplift.

"Suddenly I could see that this area had doming much like I had seen at the Desoto Canyon in the Gulf," he said. "This entire zone through the United States is suffering some type of tectonic activity that I believe is tied to the deeply buried tectonics in the Gulf of Mexico."

Answers? Questions!

Reed has developed an interpretation, which he is quick to point out is just a theory, on this tectonic activity:
As Africa jammed into North America and thrust up the Appalachians, there were compressional forces acting along the front of the mountain range.

This force caused long linear thrust faults to form in front of and parallel to the uplifting mountain chain.
Not only was the lithosphere thrust upward to form the Appalachians, some of the lithosphere was thrust downward into the asthenosphere. The result was a long, prominent bulge extending into the asthenosphere over the length of the Appalachians.

As separation from Africa occurred and the North American continent began to move westward, tensional forces came into play in the trailing edge of this moving plate. The long lithospheric downward bulge became an impediment to this plate motion as it moved over and through the asthenosphere.

This action caused a drag in plate motion with tensional forces being the greatest along a line in front of and parallel to the Appalachians.

"The results would be gradual separation of the lithosphere," he said, "likely along the older thrust fault trend."

Reed believes this rifting certainly impacted the Gulf of Mexico as well.

He also concedes that even with the years of research, several unanswered questions still exist about the Gulf's origins:

Regarding one of the most accepted theories, that updip sedimentary loading moved the salt masses in the Gulf seaward: Where is the original salt basin?

"If this salt mass movement was reversed by paleo-reconstruction and moved back to the original salt deposition basin, which would be directly south of the Cretaceous Shelf Edge, the original salt thickness would have to be in a six-figure range to accommodate this huge salt mass," he said. "It would dwarf the Himalayas."

Regarding salt distribution and the sub-horizontal, allochthonous salt flow theory: Wouldn't the salt have to be vented to an open, deepwater environment where it would, very questionably, remain unprotected for several geologic stages until covered by sediments of a later period?

"This theory doesn't take into consideration the role of the Interior basin and the Cretaceous Shelf Edge," he said, which separates the Interior and Exterior salt basins and is described in most literature as a simple Lower Cretaceous carbonate bank build-up.

"If this is true, why does a much younger Cretaceous feature divide the lower Jurassic salt basin into two parts?

"Why is there a strong magnetic response along the length of the feature?

"Why has there been igneous intrusives found along the shelf edge?"
Triple Threat?

The Cretaceous Shelf Edge along with the Suwannee Strait and the West Florida Escarpment, according to Reed, appear to be part of a triple juncture centered on the DeSoto Canyon High.

"The DeSoto Canyon High is one of the largest and most significant structures found in the Gulf," he said, measuring 137 miles by 60 miles, with over 7,000 feet of structural relief at the top of the Paleozoic.

"The Cretaceous Shelf Edge, the Suwannee Strait and the West Florida Escarpment all traverse different areas of the Gulf," he said, "but they each appear to have evolved during the same general time period and they all radiate from the central DeSoto Canyon High. This alignment would be similar to triple junctures found throughout the world."

The Suwannee Strait is a shallow Upper Cretaceous depression that extends across southern Georgia and northwestern Florida for over 200 miles. Reed said several theories have been proposed to explain the cause of the feature, but as one geologist indicated it has been easier to infer the existence of the strait than to account for it.

According to Reed, a northeastward linear projection of the Suwannee Strait would extend the feature to the earthquake cluster zone 20 miles inland from Charleston, South Carolina.

The West Florida Escarpment, the third element of the DeSoto Canyon triple juncture, has been described as a simple carbonate bank build-up. While Reed acknowledged that is true, age dating of samples collected during deepwater dredging along the escarpment indicates the feature is comprised of peritidal and lagoonal limestones with back-reef faunal assemblages deposited under restricted, low-energy conditions.

"If the steep slope face is made up of back reef material, then the question arises of where the fore-reef and the reef complex are located," he said. "It would be unlikely that equal erosion occurred over the entire escarpment, removing only the fore-reef and reef complex and leaving the back-reef.

"It would appear that some other method," he added, "such as transform shear motion, was responsible for removal of the main part of the reef complex."
Other Examples

According to Reed, tectonic plate separation apparently began along the Cretaceous Shelf Edge with the separated plate moving south, causing rifting in a zone of the basin that contained a very thick section of Jurassic salt.

This reorganization of tectonic plates in the basin would cause major orogenic movements along the bordering areas.

The rift cutting northeast through the United States, where earthquake activity has been documented in New Madrid as well as other points, is just one of these major orogenic movements. Other geologic trends that illustrate this point include:

The Late Miocene Trans-Mexico neovolcanic belt, which extends across Mexico to the Gulf Coast but apparently it never extended into the deep Gulf of Mexico Basin.

The Tuxlas volcanic field is located south of this termination and these two volcanic features seem to be connected by a series of three submarine volcanoes.

"When the right-lateral transform of the Gulf plate is extended south it falls along the trend of the submarine volcanoes," he said. "This path also takes the transform slightly west of the Tuxlas volcanic field and slightly east of the trans-Mexico volcanic belt, indicating that transform movement may have displaced these two volcanic fields.

"South movement of the Gulf plate would be necessary for this volcanic shifting scenario," he added.

The east-west trending mountain ranges of Guatemala, Honduras and Nicaragua, which were formed under compressional forces, according to Reed. These mountain ranges extend offshore in the Caribbean Sea as seamounts.

Reed asks, "Shouldn't these mountains be trending north-south to accommodate east-west compressional forces exerted by the east moving Caribbean plate? A south moving Gulf of Mexico plate would provide the compressional forces needed to build this east-west mountain trend."

Also, the east-west trending seamounts do not extend further east of a point where the left lateral transform fault of the Gulf plate is projected into the Caribbean plate.

"Eastward of this point there would be no north to south compressional forces," he said.

Another example within the deep Cayman Trench, where there is sea-floor spreading site building in a deep trench environment.

Sea-floor spreading is generally found along mid ocean ridges and forms high positive features. However, this site in the deep Cayman Trench is an extreme negative zone and prominent north-south trending spreading ridges have been generated. This zone is located east of the left lateral transform offset of the Caribbean plate.

"Motion of the south-moving Gulf of Mexico plate could solve this sea floor spreading problem," he said. A southward projection of the Gulf plate's left lateral transform would connect it with the Caribbean plates left lateral transform offset zone. The ramming of the Gulf plate into the east moving Caribbean plate would generate a zone of negative pressure east of the Caribbean plate offset.

"This action would bring hot magma into this portion of the Cayman Trench where it would build spreading ridges oriented north-south," he added.

The earthquakes in the New Madrid seismic zone and other locations along the theorized rift zone that cuts across the United States as well as the Middleton Place-Summerville seismic zone in South Carolina are tied to the tectonic movement in the Gulf of Mexico Basin, he said.

So, the obvious question for Reed is, what's the exploration potential of this rift zone that cuts through North America?

"Not much," Reed conceded. "However, if you want waterfront property you should buy land around Indianapolis. In a couple of million years this acreage could be overlooking the Strait of America that separates western (and) eastern America!"
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby 2012 Countdown » Wed Jun 09, 2010 7:22 pm

chiggerbit wrote:One piece of this evidence, according to Reed, is the apparent connection of the New Madrid seismic zone with the Gulf rift features to the south.

"This northeast trending earthquake zone appears to connect with the northeast trending Monroe Uplift, the LaSalle Arch and, possibly, to an active seismic zone located in and around Sabine Lake on the Texas-Louisiana border," he said.


"Not much," Reed conceded. "However, if you want waterfront property you should buy land around Indianapolis. In a couple of million years this acreage could be overlooking the Strait of America that separates western (and) eastern America!"


My thinking on earth's 'activity' has to do with the planetary alignments, magnetic fields, and ordinary physical forces at work in this time (2012). If we disturbed the crust it would seem to me it would promote this disturbance. I didn't even sleep in a Holiday Inn Express last night, so I am talking out of my ass. But you know, if you go back to maybe page 4-8 of this topic thread, you will see a post by me. It simply says: "Edit-crazy talk".
It was self edited out, but since we're on the subject., this image was included in that post.
Image


This is what we're talking about no?
I sure hope I get to see the sky set aflame by lighting during the next oil-hurricane before I drown.

On a more mundane note, Anderson Cooper 360 (CNN) is doing a fantastic job reporting on this. The flow rate, etc. He showed the interview with the survivors last night (brekin posted story). This entire operation was out of control big time. CRAZY. People belong in jail right now.
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby chiggerbit » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:12 pm

This is what we're talking about no?


Looking at the map at the link, I'd say there were a LOT of similarities with yours above.
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby 2012 Countdown » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:26 pm

chiggerbit wrote:
This is what we're talking about no?


Looking at the map at the link, I'd say there were a LOT of similarities with yours above.


I'd just read the article and didn't know there was a friggin map. Oh, that's worth a post-



Good lord. When I saw that the sea floor sank a bit, I thought of the Cayce map. Now you've posted THIS.
Image
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby justdrew » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:54 pm

chiggerbit wrote:
This is what we're talking about no?


Looking at the map at the link, I'd say there were a LOT of similarities with yours above.


oh damn, nice find chiggerbit I'm going to have to read up on that...

Rare Earthquake Shakes Gulf of Mexico
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby chiggerbit » Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:58 pm

And Sunday's quake should have little to no effect on development of recently discovered oil reserves deep beneath the Gulf


Uh huh.
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby 2012 Countdown » Thu Jun 10, 2010 12:09 am

Well, as the kids say, 'boom goes the dynamite'...

The Spill, The Scandal and the President
The inside story of how Obama failed to crack down on the corruption of the Bush years – and let the world's most dangerous oil company get away with murder

By Tim Dickinson
Jun 08, 2010 4:30 PM EDT

By the time Obama spoke, it was increasingly evident that this was not merely an ecological disaster. It was the most devastating assault on American soil since 9/11.

Like the attacks by Al Qaeda, the disaster in the Gulf was preceded by ample warnings – yet the administration had ignored them. Instead of cracking down on MMS, as he had vowed to do even before taking office, Obama left in place many of the top officials who oversaw the agency's culture of corruption. He permitted it to rubber-stamp dangerous drilling operations by BP – a firm with the worst safety record of any oil company – with virtually no environmental safeguards, using industry-friendly regulations drafted during the Bush years. He calibrated his response to the Gulf spill based on flawed and misleading estimates from BP – and then deployed his top aides to lowball the flow rate at a laughable 5,000 barrels a day, long after the best science made clear this catastrophe would eclipse the Exxon Valdez.

Even after the president's press conference, Rolling Stone has learned, the administration knew the spill could be far worse than its "best estimate" acknowledged. That same day, the president's Flow Rate Technical Group – a team of scientists charged with establishing the gusher's output – announced a new estimate of 12,000 to 25,000 barrels, based on calculations from video of the plume. In fact, according to interviews with team members and scientists familiar with its work, that figure represents the plume group's minimum estimate. The upper range was not included in their report because scientists analyzing the flow were unable to reach a consensus on how bad it could be. "The upper bound from the plume group, if it had come out, is very high," says Timothy Crone, a marine geophysicist at Columbia University who has consulted with the government's team. "That's why they had resistance internally. We're talking 100,000 barrels a day."


http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/ne ... how_page=0

Hours after BP’s rig sank on April 22nd, a white board in NOAA's "war room" in Seattle displays the administration's initial,
worst-case estimate of the spill — 64,000 to 110,000 barrels a day.

Image

====

"Hours after"? Way back on Apr22nd?
Busted.
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby 82_28 » Thu Jun 10, 2010 1:07 am

Image


Who Really Owns the Gulf of Mexico?

Who owns the Gulf of Mexico? That's a question you have to ask while perusing Offshore magazine's 2010 poster of the Gulf—downloadable here as a large PDF, but well worth checking out. Where most people look at the Gulf, they see a vast marine ecosystem, wetlands, and, until recently, gorgeous beaches.

What energy executives see is a massive grid, tangled with scores of oil and gas pipelines and rival fields with macho names that sound like heavy metal bands, black-diamond ski runs, and weapons systems. (See "Quiz: What Do BP and Kurt Cobain Have in Common?") Here's a small detail, slightly blurry, but you get the point. (Red lines are gas pipelines and pink are gas fields, green lines are oil pipelines and green blurbs are oil fields.)

What these maps really show is the degree to which the Gulf has played host to a feeding frenzy by big energy interests that snap up drilling leases on the cheap. Each of these numbered squares represents a lease site. As you can see from this Offshore magazine chart, the highest bid for a lease this year was about $53 million. Which, when you consider the value of the oil coming out of the Gulf, is chicken feed.


http://motherjones.com/mojo/2010/06/who ... oil-leases
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby 82_28 » Thu Jun 10, 2010 1:24 am

Some are saying the wellhead actually caught on fire. BELOW THE SEA!

Image

Here's where I found this info:

http://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/cd ... opment_in/

Watching the live feed -- the gusher looks even more violent than ever.

http://www.ustream.tv/pbsnewshour
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby justdrew » Thu Jun 10, 2010 1:30 am

the "flame" appears to be coming out of some metal tube.

an illusion I guess:
http://www.theoildrum.com/node/6583#comment-646101
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby 8bitagent » Thu Jun 10, 2010 2:14 am

I wasn't expecting the oil spill to be this apocalyptic....man.

I've heard every theory from "north korean sabotage"(wtf?) to "Haliburton employees rigged it"...could it be that mother nature is simply getting uppity all over?
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby 2012 Countdown » Thu Jun 10, 2010 7:41 am

2012 Countdown wrote:Well, as the kids say, 'boom goes the dynamite'...

The Spill, The Scandal and the President
The inside story of how Obama failed to crack down on the corruption of the Bush years – and let the world's most dangerous oil company get away with murder

By Tim Dickinson
Jun 08, 2010 4:30 PM EDT

By the time Obama spoke, it was increasingly evident that this was not merely an ecological disaster. It was the most devastating assault on American soil since 9/11.

Like the attacks by Al Qaeda, the disaster in the Gulf was preceded by ample warnings – yet the administration had ignored them. Instead of cracking down on MMS, as he had vowed to do even before taking office, Obama left in place many of the top officials who oversaw the agency's culture of corruption. He permitted it to rubber-stamp dangerous drilling operations by BP – a firm with the worst safety record of any oil company – with virtually no environmental safeguards, using industry-friendly regulations drafted during the Bush years. He calibrated his response to the Gulf spill based on flawed and misleading estimates from BP – and then deployed his top aides to lowball the flow rate at a laughable 5,000 barrels a day, long after the best science made clear this catastrophe would eclipse the Exxon Valdez.

Even after the president's press conference, Rolling Stone has learned, the administration knew the spill could be far worse than its "best estimate" acknowledged. That same day, the president's Flow Rate Technical Group – a team of scientists charged with establishing the gusher's output – announced a new estimate of 12,000 to 25,000 barrels, based on calculations from video of the plume. In fact, according to interviews with team members and scientists familiar with its work, that figure represents the plume group's minimum estimate. The upper range was not included in their report because scientists analyzing the flow were unable to reach a consensus on how bad it could be. "The upper bound from the plume group, if it had come out, is very high," says Timothy Crone, a marine geophysicist at Columbia University who has consulted with the government's team. "That's why they had resistance internally. We're talking 100,000 barrels a day."


http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/ne ... how_page=0

Hours after BP’s rig sank on April 22nd, a white board in NOAA's "war room" in Seattle displays the administration's initial,
worst-case estimate of the spill — 64,000 to 110,000 barrels a day.

Image

====

"Hours after"? Way back on Apr22nd?
Busted.


I would suggest this article is REQUIRED READING, further quoting:
Within hours, the government assembled a response team at the "war room" of the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration in Seattle. The scene, captured by a NOAA cameraman and briefly posted on the agency's website, provides remarkable insight into the government's engagement during the earliest hours of the catastrophe, and, more troubling, the role of top administration figures in downplaying its horrific scope.

At a conference table, nearly a dozen scientists gather around a map of the Gulf. Joshua Slater, a commissioned NOAA officer dressed in his uniform, runs the show. "So far we've created a trajectory that was passed up the chain of command to the Coast Guard and eventually to the president showing where the oil might go," he tells the assembled team. BP's remote operated sub, he adds, "was unsuccessful in activating the blowout preventers, so we're gearing up right now."

An NOAA expert on oil disasters jumps in: "I think we need to be prepared for it to be the spill of the decade."

Written on a whiteboard at the front of the room is the government's initial, worst-case estimate of the size of the spill. While the figure is dramatically higher than any official estimate issued by BP or the government, it is in line with the high-end calculations by scientists who have monitored the spill.

"Estm: 64k - 110k bbls/Day." The equivalent of up to three Exxon Valdez spills gushing into the Gulf of Mexico every week.

Damningly, the whiteboard also documents the disconnect between what the government suspected to be the magnitude of the disaster and the far lower estimates it was feeding to the public. Written below the federal estimate are the words, "300,000 gal/day reported on CNN." Appearing on the network that same day on a video feed from the Gulf, Coast Guard Rear Adm. Mary Landry insisted that the government had no figure. "We do not have an estimate of the amount of crude emanating from the wellhead," she said.

Later in the video, a voice on speakerphone with a heavy Southern accent reveals that government scientists were concerned from the very beginning about underwater plumes of oil – a reality that NOAA administrator Jane Lubchenco and BP executives are still seeking to downplay. "They weren't sure how that oil was going to react once it was spilled," the voice says. "Whether it was going to rise, or form layers and start twisting around." The government, in short, knew from the start that surface measurements of the oil slick – on which it would premise its absurdly low estimate of 5,000 barrels a day – were likely to be unreliable.
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Re: 'Not for public': the oil spill may be getting much worse

Postby 2012 Countdown » Thu Jun 10, 2010 2:45 pm

Humor-
BP board execs spill a cup of coffee-video skit

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AAa0gd7 ... _embedded#!
=====
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