Barak Obama - Child of the C.I.A.

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Re: Barak Obama - Child of the C.I.A.

Postby hava1 » Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:42 pm

Appear AD you are conversing with my original comment, but indirectly, I will allow myself same.

The story about the MK victim/Jew friend elicited some comments from me earlier on this board. I had mentioned with discomfort the appearance of three very dominant and aggressive posters (DE, Prof. something and AD) who all wrote as non jews, with either spouses or female close friends with MK histories, all of them Jewish.

While its possibel that this board attracts not only mk victims but also their partners and friends, the situation was odd, given my Jewish affiliation as well (and I believe 2 other self described mk victims, who post here present themselves as jewish american ladies). However, my comments were dismissed impolitely, to say the least.

I found it odd that posters make a career out of their friends/spouse life story, and then complain that they are manipulative, because I think its manipulative to build a semi career in journalism, screen writing, pc games planning, talkbackism, and what not, based on someone's supposed life history, and drive them nuts, and then complain that they are mad, or thieves.

Having said that, the survivor community is awful, regretfully, I believe the majority of survivors do not lose the habit of hurting those who are trying to help them and being hurtful and distrustful or bullies, as a rule. present company included.

Lastly, survivors are human beings, and are no better, as victims are not better, that's a constant pit many fall into.

and really last, from the little I sense you personally, I would expect you to be nice and believing to pathological liars, and contemptuous and abusing towards the sincere, as a rule, same towards mk victims so i would not rely on your judgement to start with. there are many pathological liars out there, some of them pose as victims, some are or have been victims, and they find the people they can exploit, if you are sincere in your efforts to assist mk victims, one liar (if that's the case) or a bitch, should not matter at all. I helped many so called disadvantaged people as a lawyer in a clinic, and many were liars and manipulative. More so, i never met a totally honest client in my whole life. people in need,victims and survivors of something are usually not nice, they are fighting for their life.

as to tools, I meant professional tools (certifications), not spying skills, that I acquired. the masters own everything, so, that leaves the victims with breathing skills, and that's that. i think the concept of the "masters tools" that you quoted, is outdated. the masters now have all the tools.
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Re: Barak Obama - Child of the C.I.A.

Postby American Dream » Sun Oct 10, 2010 11:56 am

I've not been posting anything here with an interest in conversing with Hava, so I want to clarify that point before I add anything more here.

That said, I do have some questions about recovery that I want to share:


If one of the goals of these programs includes the use of childhood abuse in order to create a sort of sociopathy, then what does freeing one's mind entail under these kinds of circumstances?

How does one find empathy and respect for others, solidarity, and even love for other human beings when one of the goals of the abuse was always to minimize or destroy compassionate and ethical relations with others?


I think that most of us who didn't experience this kind of abuse directly would find it really, really hard to imagine what recovery actually means under these sorts of circumstances...
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Re: Barak Obama - Child of the C.I.A.

Postby surfaceskimmer » Sun Oct 10, 2010 1:40 pm

Before commenting:

I am not an MK survivor. I do think I had a brush-by experience with something related to it (it appears there was a time when the "arts" went public in the hands of more civilian types, something akin to the filtering down of Abu Ghraib-type behaviors into police departments and elsewhere), but I don't claim to have inside knowledge or experience.

I do not think the POTUS has been Manchurianized in the sense that someone is in his head and programming him from behind or that anything he does or says is the product of what he is being made to do or say beyond normal methods. I am guessing he has been raised and conditioned, no worse than any of us have been raised and conditioned, in a milieu. Perhaps it is a statement that the MK-Ultra and related mind control techniques have been polished like river rocks over the years and now appear very similar to that which many people experience in the milieu of a dysfunctional household, a fundamentalist politcal/religious environment, and pre-selected schooling curriculum (which ought to frighten us more than the idea that the POTUS is a "made man"). I have a small library awaiting my attention and synthesis on psychopathology as it applies to politics; nothing much new or secret there, as leading authors have written about it for some time (See, e.g., Derrick Jensen).

I did, in the years 5-15, I am quite certain, experience a more-intense-than-usual brand of physical and psychological abuse. And therefore:

@American Dream:

In my case, recovery came from absenting myself briefly and then finally, from standing up to it at one point and stating I would no longer allow it, and from meditation. I didn't know it was meditation at the time; I just used to escape and sit alone in the woods for hours. It also helped to get to know other families and to look for parenting elsewhere, including in my own reading and research into spiritual matters, psychology, somatics, etc.

I would point to two books in particular by Peter Levine ("Waking The Tiger" and "Healing Trauma"), as well as John Bradshaw's "Healing The Shame That Binds You". "Freedom From the Inside Out" by Nathalie Goldrain, "Getting Our Bodies Back" by Christine Caldwell, "How Long Till My Soul Gets It Right?" by Robert Alter with Jane Alter, works by Sam Keen and Robert Bly, and perhaps various works by Richard Strozzi Heckler and Wendy Palmer. Athletics and aikido in particular may allow the body to recover some sense of normalcy and empowerment. My research began in the arena of sports psychology, moved to performance psychology, popular neuroscience, noetics and more. There are many sources on meditation and related topics.

In the end, you re-learn to love yourself and allow yourself to be loved by loving... something, someone... by finding an outlet for doing, getting invested in something, and learning to see and look for the beauty and wondrousness of life in many places.
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Re: Barak Obama - Child of the C.I.A.

Postby American Dream » Wed Oct 13, 2010 9:27 am

I've been thinking about this more and I'd like to mention another element that seems absolutely essential to recovery from mind control: critical thinking.

Although I do not have the experience of being consistently abused and manipulated since early childhood as some did- and I do recognize that this is a serious difference- I did experience some serious things of this nature as a young adult.

Logical thinking may seem "square" to some, but it is your friend. Critical thinking and reality testing are very, very important and can help deconstruct manipulative discourse from "friends" who want to use the hook of unresolved traumas and submerged feelings in order to lead us down a certain road.

This may seem obvious, but it certainly bears repeating!
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Re: Barak Obama - Child of the C.I.A.

Postby surfaceskimmer » Wed Oct 13, 2010 9:48 pm

I'm all in favor of critical thinking... i.e., the effective use of logic, reason and the left brain.... but this must not proceed without accompaniment by full and effective use of the right brain, emotional intelligence, and intuition, as well as giving some credence (especially in the absence of external influences like pressured input from others, pharmaceutical or other substance influence, group-think or cult-like influences) to what is termed anomalous cognition. While the science has yet to fully catch up (the age of research into the cognitive wilderness of the mind is still 20 years young), there is enough evidence to insist that it not be dismissed. The full use of and balance in dual-hemispheric and triune layers of the brain still lines in the future for us.
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Re: Barak Obama - Child of the C.I.A.

Postby American Dream » Thu Oct 14, 2010 11:31 am

I very much agree, surrfaceskimmer- we need both hemispheres of the brain and we need them to be balanced, most especially when trauma and/or extraordinary experience have been used to systematically manipulate our basic perception of reality...
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Re: Barak Obama - Child of the C.I.A.

Postby redsock » Sun May 07, 2017 4:08 pm

A very bad review.

A Long, Long Look at Obama’s Life, Mostly Before the White House
Reviewed by Michiko Kakutani, The New York Times, May 1, 2017


RISING STAR
The Making of Barack Obama
By David J. Garrow
1,460 pages. William Morrow. $45.

“Rising Star,” the voluminous 1,460-page biography of Barack Obama by David J. Garrow, is a dreary slog of a read: a bloated, tedious and — given its highly intemperate epilogue — ill-considered book that is in desperate need of editing, and way more exhausting than exhaustive.

Many of the more revealing moments in this volume will be familiar to readers of Obama’s own memoir, “Dreams From My Father”; a host of earlier books about Obama and his family; and myriad profiles of the former president that have appeared in newspapers and magazines over the years. Garrow has turned up little that’s substantially new — save for identifying and interviewing an old girlfriend from Obama’s early Chicago years, who claims that by 1987, “he already had his sights on becoming president.”

In the absence of thoughtful analysis or a powerful narrative through line, Garrow’s book settles for barraging the reader with a cascade of details — seemingly in hopes of creating a kind of pointillist picture. The problem is that all these data points never connect to form an illuminating portrait; the book does not open out to become the sort of resonant narrative that Robert A. Caro and Ron Chernow have pioneered, in which momentous historical events are deftly recreated, and a subject’s life is situated in a time and a place. Instead, Garrow has expended a huge amount of energy — his bibliography, including interviews with more than a thousand people, runs to 35 pages — on giving us minutely detailed accounts of early chapters of Obama’s life, like his years at Harvard Law School, his time in Chicago as a community organizer, and his work in the Illinois State Senate. Garrow gets to Obama’s presidency only in an epilogue.

While the Chicago chapter sheds valuable light on Obama’s connection with black residents and his developing sense of vocation, many of the other sections that try to chronicle his day-to-day life feel extraneous and absurdly long-winded, as if Garrow wanted to include every last scrap of information he’d unearthed. Are we really interested in what numerous Obama classmates, colleagues and passing acquaintances remember about his personality — that he struck them as cool or friendly, arrogant or voluble, cheerful or detached? Do we really want to read repetitious discussions about his cigarette consumption and poker-playing habits?

Indeed, this entire book suffers from a poor sense of proportion. Garrow adds nothing to our understanding of Obama’s intellectual evolution during his years at Columbia, or the role that the civil rights movement played in shaping his political consciousness and ideals. (Curious, given that Garrow, a professor at the University of Pittsburgh School of Law, won a Pulitzer Prize in 1987 for his book on the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., “Bearing the Cross.”) And yet Garrow prattles on for pages about legislation Obama worked on in the Illinois State Senate, and about discussions in law school classes he attended or taught. The entire first chapter of the book is devoted to examining the social and political landscape of Chicago’s South Side in the early 1980s before Obama arrived to work there, but Obama’s 2008 campaign and two terms in the White House are compressed into a 50-odd-page epilogue.

Perhaps, as the title “Rising Star” indicates, this book is meant to focus only on Obama’s early years, but in that case, the epilogue — with the snarky title of “The President Did Not Attend, as He Was Golfing” — seems even more inexplicable.

Whereas the rest of the book is written in dry, largely uninflected prose, the epilogue — which almost reads like a Republican attack ad — devolves into a condescending diatribe unworthy of a serious historian. It consists mainly of a string of negative quotations about Obama’s presidency and temperament, many plucked out of context from articles and books by journalists and commentators, or extracted from disillusioned former friends or supporters. There is no considered weighing of the record, no real recognition of the achievements of Obama’s two terms in office (including his handling of the financial crisis that he inherited and passing Obamacare). Nor is there any useful explication of the policy decisions (like flip-flopping on Syria, and failing to close a deal enabling a sizable number of American forces to remain in Iraq beyond 2011) that have elicited sustained criticism from both government insiders and outside experts.

Instead, Garrow’s epilogue delivers a crude screed against Obama the president and Obama the man, filled with bald assertions and coy half-truths. He suggests that Obama’s presidency was a long string of failures and disappointments and that “behind the scenes, many Democrats were just as eager for Barack to exit the White House as he himself now seemed,” when, in fact, he left office as one of the most popular presidents in recent decades.

Garrow takes Obama to task for his lack of “bipartisan outreach” with Republican members of Congress, but doesn’t tell the other side of the story — namely, the Republicans’ deliberate strategy of obstructionism throughout Obama’s tenure in office. (The Republican Senate leader Mitch McConnell famously declared, “The single most important thing we want to achieve is for President Obama to be a one-term president.”) And, as the chapter title indicates, Garrow even mocks Obama, repeatedly, for spending too much time on the golf course. (What, one wonders, would he make of Donald J. Trump?)

Then there is the innuendo. Garrow portentously cites a poll indicating that 64 percent of Republicans and 42 percent of whites agreed that it was “probably true” that Obama was “hiding important information about his background and early life.” This could be a reference to the birther movement, or perhaps to the bitter musings of Sheila Miyoshi Jager, the former girlfriend Obama had met in Chicago — who remained upset for years over their breakup, and whom Garrow has turned into one of his main sources. Jager is quoted as saying that “something changed” in Obama “after we went our separate ways after Harvard, as if the part of him that was so vulnerable and open (and sensual?) went underground and something else — raging ambition, quest for greatness, whatever just took over instead.”

It’s odd that Garrow should seize on one former lover’s anger and hurt, and try to turn them into a Rosebud-like key to the former president’s life, referring to her repeatedly in his epilogue. He even tries to turn her perception — about Obama’s having willed himself into being — into a pejorative, when the act of self-invention, as other biographers have noted, was the enterprising and existential act of a young man who essentially had been abandoned by both his black father and white mother, and who found himself caught between cultures and trying, as he wrote in “Dreams,” “to raise myself to be a black man in America.”

Perhaps Garrow leans so heavily on Jager because she is a source mentioned only in passing (and not by name) in David Maraniss’s “Barack Obama: The Story” (2012). It’s telling, after all, that Garrow mischaracterizes the reception that both Maraniss’s biography and David Remnick’s incisive book “The Bridge” received, suggesting that both volumes failed to get the accolades they did, in fact, receive.

The reader interested in Barack Obama’s life would do well to turn to those books, and not Garrow’s overstuffed and ultimately unfair work here. Or, go back to Obama’s own eloquent memoir.

A version of this review appears in print on May 2, 2017, on Page C1 of the New York edition with the headline: On Obama; And On, And On, And On.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/01/book ... -the-times
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Re: Barak Obama - Child of the C.I.A.

Postby brekin » Mon May 08, 2017 1:54 pm

Garrow gets to Obama’s presidency only in an epilogue.


Fitting, and an epilogue might be too long. The title alone of "The Gift, squandered" would probably be enough. And not much more need be said. I can't think of a recent candidate who did so little with so much. Obama parasailing as the world burns now I think is pretty telling.

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