Simulist wrote:Joe Hillshoist wrote:brainpanhandler wrote:Joe Hillshoist wrote:One problem with upward mobility, especially for people trying to move out of poverty is their susceptibility to right wing tropes.
It's counterintuitive, but yah, that seems to be the case. And frankly susceptibility to right wing tropes is a trait that signifies, what? Intelligence?
It signifies that a particular meme is being activated I reckon. One to do with gathering territory and securing it. I don't think that has to do with intelligence per se, but you know, whats intelligence?
It may not be easy to say what intelligence is, but it's often pretty easy to see what it isn't.
Sigh. What's intelligence? It's a fair question of course and you'd think I'd be prepared to answer it if I'm going to go on about it. There are lots of paths to that question and the explicit attempts at answering it are basically more or less comprehensive. How many qualities does one put under that one umbrella term, intelligence? That's seems to sum up the differences between the various models for "intelligence". I guess it's probably a hopeless term that is so contentious that I really ought never use it, especially here where I won't get away with using it in a colloquial manner.
In order to offer you some response without having to spend a couple of hours composing it I'll try to address the more narrow context of the gathering and securing territory meme you suggest, not least of which because it so readily suggests a model of human consciousness we're probably both familiar with, to wit, the RAW/Leary 8 circuit model of consciousness. A great deal of what most of us regard as "intelligence" is a product of good semantic circuit imprints. That is the third circuit we imprint chronologically. If we are able to master abstract symbol systems and decipher extrasomatic stores of knowledge, if we are able to clearly, in the culturally dominate form manipulate those symbol systems to communicate, we are generally regarded as intelligent. To a large extent it is competence on the semantic circuit that is being tested on standardized tests. With deft enough use of language we mark ourselves as belonging to the educated classes. You're really not welcome if you can't speak the language. Unless of course you can bully your way to the top via a dominate second circuit imprint; in raw's (leary/freud) model the anal emotional territorial circuit.
raw wrote:In terms of the present theory, the
differences between domesticated primates (humans) and other
domesticated animals are virtually nil, as long as we are talking
only about the first two circuits. (Since most people spend most
of their time on these primitive circuits, the differences are often
much less obvious than the similarities.) Real differences begin
to appear when the third, semantic circuit enters the picture.
Prometheus Rising
When I consider the 8 circuit model I imagine it as a wisdom/freedom continuum. Now if one happens to live an incredibly charmed life and has nothing but non-neurotic imprints as one progresses through life and each circuit is activated... well, that must not happen very often. For the rest of us unfortunates we have to muster the self awareness and determination to undo disabling imprints and forge ahead toward some greater gestalt on the higher circuits; life is a struggle, enlightenment a seemingly endlessly receding horizon.
If an individual is heavily imprinted as top dog on the second circuit (anal/emotional/territorial) and lives mostly motivated by the acquisitive, dominance concerns of that circuit then that indiviual could be considered a spiritually impoverished infant tyrant. In the real world this infant tyrant, if possessing the weapons to enforce it's wishes, can manifest as a monstrosity. The second circuit is the foundation of fascism. Fear, territoriality, dominance/submission (to authority), these are all imprints on the primitive second circuit.
I guess I would argue that an individual unwilling or unable to recognize the central importance of the dictum, "know thyself", such that they can free themselves from the undue influence of the primitive circuits cannot in my mind be considered intelligent. So, my defintion oif intelligence includes the ability to reflect on oneself, to know oneself. To even so much as put a unifrom on, let alone obey an order to murder innocents suggests to me a being that is stuck in the concerns of the second circuit to a greater extent than will allow effective self reflection.

There are always exceptions. There are no hard and fast rules.