Monarch Program Part 1 Trigger Warning

[Grizzly]

talk about the monarch program and the tactics that are used to make the monarch look crazy when they start breaking their programming. I also cover technology that could be used on monarchs and MK ultra victims in order to mimic schizophrenia. I repeat myself a lot, I'm sorry. I have a difficult time finding the right words to explain things as a result of all the trauma I have been put through

[Simulist]

Hi, Grizzly. You may find the following post (and portions of the associated thread) to be of interest.

From the comments to his article Albarelli addresses the issue.

http://www.truthout.org/cries-from-past ... choes59738

Mon, 05/24/2010 - 13:33 — H.P. Albarelli Jr.

I researched the CIA's programs for over 17 years. As far as I could see and find, there is/was no Monarch project. Indeed, I was told by the fellow who first wrote about it that it was a fabricated project on his part and that he has regretted the creation for years. It is not necessary to make MKULTRA and Artichoke any worse than they were. They were absolutely horrible programs and the attempts to embellish them with made-up projects is not helpful or needed. In fact, it readily serves the Agency's disinformation objectives to scatter this fabricated disinfo dust over the real story. Ms. Van Bergen is correct: victim accounts are helpful and needed. These are forthcoming in additional articles that will be posted on Truthout. As expected, victims are quite afraid and apprehensive about coming forward. The victim identified as Sally Hartman in my book is the best evidenced account I have seen. The harm done to this woman by the CIA is hard to fathom. Perhaps we will post that section form the book somewhere on the net so that more people can see and read it. HPA/

RIer's who've paid attention to this topic can probably figure out that regretful source, but let us now put to rest finally the question as to whether it's a bonafide project name. Interestingly, it doesn't appear to be deliberate disinfo either. Can one retract a meme?

Project Monarch

Actually, if you listen to the radiation committee testimony, one of the vics quotes Gottlieb telling her she "Is ripe for the big A", Artichoke. So perhaps TBMC activity fell under that project name. Hopefully one day we shall find out for certain what label they used for their horrendous work on kids.

[Project Willow]

[In reference to the OP video] Please don't spread agency generated favorable disinformation on RI.

Thanks.

Edited for clarity.

I think it might be helpful for survivors as a community to create a list of respectful requests for the lay public that might include something like: Please refrain from linking my personal story to unsubstantiated rumors or speculation about celebrities, please consider directing your energy into helping victims instead.

[Grizzly]

Not to sound disrespectful, but your an athority? How? What if what you believe is the spreading of "dis-information?

[Simulist]

Not to sound disrespectful, but your an athority? How? What if what you believe is the spreading of "dis-information?

Project Willow knows more about these topics than probably anyone I've ever encountered — and her information is almost always backed up (or, at the very least, able to be backed up) by sources or other corroborating evidence. You may find it helpful to visit her DIDiva "About" page and the rest of her site for more information.

Which is why earlier I referred you to a prior thread on this topic. Have you read any of that, Grizzly?

[Grizzly]

Not to be disrespectful but, your an athority? How? Why should anyone trust your view? How is this "disinformation"? Why the accusatory tone?

[Simulist]

Why the accusatory tone?

Because you don't appear to listen? At all?

Just a guess.

[Peregrine]

Why the accusatory tone?

Grizzly, I didn't see any accusatory tone, they were both pretty straight forward & polite. This is a pretty sensitive topic for many here that have been through these experiences.

[elfismiles]

Grizzly, check out the recommended threads.

None of us (afaik) are saying that the kinds of practices described as "Project Monarch" didn't take place - but as with so much conspiracy culture there is a lot of unverified material and "Project Monarch" fits that description.

In other words, while there may very well have been / still be mind kontrol (MK) projects that used children, created Manchurian Candidate Couriers, Sex Slaves and Assassins, there has never been any verified documentation with the name "Project Monarch" attached to it.

And according to Albarelli (one of THE experts on what IS documented about MK-Ultra and related sub-projects like Artichoke) the person who originally started using the phrase "Project Monarch" has stated: "I researched the CIA's programs for over 17 years. As far as I could see and find, there is/was no Monarch project. Indeed, I was told by the fellow who first wrote about it that it was a fabricated project on his part and that he has regretted the creation for years."

So, while there are PLENTY of people claiming to be survivors of what they call "Project Monarch" there are none who have been able to document such a project existing with that name.

Best evidence is that MK-Ultra DID experiment on kids but that those documents were destroyed before the Church Committee Hearings could examinie them in the hearings which revealed most of the initial evidence we have for the existence of MK-Ultra, MK-Delta, MK-Naomi, Artichoke and the other VERIFIED sub-programs.

I believe it was the SUNSHINE-PROJECT (http://www.sunshine-project.org) which had uncovered the evidence of said document destruction.

[Grizzly]

Because you don't appear to listen? At all?

What?

Grizzly, I didn't see any accusatory tone, they were both pretty straight forward & polite. This is a pretty sensitive topic for many here that have been through these experiences.

when somebody says I need to quit spreading "disinformation", that seems pretty clerical to me. I concur as to it being a deligate topic, as I myself am a incest survivor. With all the pain, truama and trust issues and disillusion that goes with it.

[Peregrine]

ffs...

There was a please & thank you in there, c'mon. Perhaps you did not know the source was disinfo? And yes, there's quite a few of us incest survivors here, it is unfortunately not an uncommon thing.

[Grizzly]

Why are my comments being deleted? Sorry, they weren't there must have been a delay... Sorry I brought this up. It's more energy that I care to engage in, consider this dropped. Geez, before I can finish a reply someone else jumps in, I don't have it in me, I'm pooped. I just found the vid interesting didn't mean to cause the "ffs's" and "come-on's" and "why aren't you listenings"... I will check out those links thanks.

[Project Willow]

Oh dear, no firestorm intended.

Not to sound disrespectful, but your an athority? How? What if what you believe is the spreading of "dis-information?

I try my very best never to believe anything concerning these issues. Speculation is not a friend in most cases.

I would guess that you are unfamiliar with the work on mind control of respected researchers and survivors, which the young lady in the video casually contradicts in places. Please correct me if I am wrong however.

If you want a little mind control 101, I'd start here:

Two nice FAQs.
http://natrcoalition.org/faq/#mc
http://ra-info.org/mind-control/

Survivors testifying before congress in 1995.


Short list of respected research books.
Bowart, Walter, M.D. Operation Mind Control. Dell Publishing, 1979.(rev. 1994). https://sites.google.com/site/mcrais/vomc
Bain, Donald. The CIA's Control of Candy Jones. Barricade Books, 2002.
Ross, Colin A. The CIA Doctors: Human Rights Violations by American Psychiatrists. Manitou Communications, 2006.
Albarelli Jr., H.P. A Terrible Mistake: The Murder of Frank Olson and The CIA's Cold War Experiments. Trine Day, 2009.

Something I just posted the other day:
http://www.rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?p=464237#p464237

What about the evidence for GMC? ...

For example, Lynn Schirmer and Carol Rutz, who have never met each other in person, have
published similar sketches depicting their memories of having been tortured in mind control
experiments as children.

[Simulist]

Because you don't appear to listen? At all?

What?

Well, then let me break it down for you.

You posted a video of... someone... talking about "Project Monarch" — no context for the alleged information presented in the video or why you found it to be of interest (or possibly even credible), and no information about the person doing the video or why you even chose to post it.

Then you went away for a few hours.

In the meantime, I reposted some information providing context for you about where this community has already been on that topic. So far there is absolutely ZERO indication that you've bothered even to read it and almost no indication that you have chosen to listen to the concerns that have been pointed out to you — except to find an "accusatory tone" in it for you to be offended by. Repeatedly.

Yeah: you don't appear to listen or even to care enough to give the appearance of listening.

(Which really isn't anything new for you. At all. I recall a thread you began called "Chris Hedges, CIA?" based on nothing more than anonymous comments by some posters at Moon Of Alabama. Then you went away for a few hours. When you came back, you were offended that you had been challenged, claiming that you were "done posting here." You know, instead of maybe listening to WHY people got upset by that.)

Since you asked.

[Peregrine]

Oh interwebs & the lack of tone inflection...

Why are my comments being deleted? Sorry, they weren't there must have been a delay... Sorry I brought this up. It's more energy that I care to engage in, consider this dropped. Geez, before I can finish a reply someone else jumps in, I don't have it in me, I'm pooped. I just found the vid interesting didn't mean to cause the "ffs's" and "come-on's" and "why aren't you listenings"... I will check out those links thanks.

I'm rather cranky today, been fighting off a cold. All better, I cat-napped & ate something with chocolate to assuage the beast. the "ffs & c'mon" is just mild irritation, no jumping on Grizzly intended. I remember the last kerfuffle in the chris hedges thread.
C'mon, ffs, have a chocolate grizzly bear biscuit. They're good.