Ken O' Keefe.

[slimmouse]

BTW I would be very surprised if the whole St3rmfront operation isnt an FBI honeypot.

There you have it from my angle too. Rent an extremist on a stick, stirring up all the shit you can along the way.

Same with the English 'neo-nazis' . Wasnt NIck Griffin implicated with MI5 a few years back?

I mean ffs, who in their right mind follows these clots?

[American Dream]

[slimmouse]

Well of course, thats exactly how we're supposed to feel.

And Im not buying it because I know that ultimately, were all far better than that.

[American Dream]

Well of course, thats exactly how we're supposed to feel.

And Im not buying it because I know that ultimately, were all far better than that.

We all have the potential to be better than that.

Unfortunately, this thread provides evidence that we've still got a way to go- and those so-called "friends" of Palestine are not helping...

[slimmouse]

We all have the potential to be better than that.

Unfortunately, this thread provides evidence that we've still got a way to go- and those so-called "friends" of Palestine are not helping..

I agree wholeheartedly. Case closed I guess?

[Searcher08]

Personally, I find it a very very tricky country to navigate. For example, my perception is that (at least in Europe) the far right come in many different flavours - in Greece where I have some friends, they report a huge polarisation of society. Golden Dawn are a REALLY nasty bunch who seem to have infiltrated many of the local police forces.
The EDL are probably funded by the City and it wouldnt surprise me if they are not also a honeypot for Islamists and have socially engineered entrapment type scenarios. They are also very pro Israel. One problem with them is engaging with very thorny issues of abuse and child trafficking that exists in a particular section of the South Asian community.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... rward.html
The guy who runs the EDL seems absolutely traumatised by Muslims - when he talks about them he seems to be in a state of fear verging on terrified.
The BNP seem to have a lot of criminal / 'security' industry connections aka steroided-up bouncers who seem to spend more time punching each other out as anyone else. They seem a really scummy lot.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/peter-g ... 87761.html

[American Dream]

It is important to look at the association David Duke has enjoyed with Kenneth O'Keefe, Gilad Atzmon, Israel Shamir and others of that ilk.

More important is the why: what do all these "friends" of Palestinian liberation share in common? And what's missing from what they say?

This points towards an answer:


http://azvsas.blogspot.com/2012/03/gila ... e-bds.html

Saturday, 3 March 2012

Gilad Atzmon Tour Hopes to Divide the BDS Movement in in USA


The Wandering Fool Tries His Hand in the USA

Gilad Atzmon, not content with his destruction and divisiveness in Europe, hopes to create similar divisions between Jewish and non Jewish anti-Zionists and supporters of the Palestinians in the United States. Perhaps having seen his supporters comprehensively defeated in Britain’s Palestine Solidarity Campaign conference in January, he decided that the growing BDS movement in the USA offers greater opportnities.

Whether Atzmon does this, as has been suggested, because he is an Israeli state asset is an open question which we may never know. See my article on how Atzmon and his closest supporter, Mary Rizzo, fell out over his friendship with an Israeli informer, one Morris Herman. http://azvsas.blogspot.com/2011/12/mary ... g-out.html What is known is that the Zionists rub their hands in glee and openly welcome his divisiveness.

A welcome statement, although overlong, from the organisers of an ad-hoc alliance against Atzmon’s poison. It is particularly welcome that Arabs such as As'ad AbuKhalil, known as the Angry Arab, heads the list. It is a great pity that Palestinians such as Joseph Massad have chosen to stay silent and it is to be hoped that the idiocy that welcomed Oslo doesn’t persist on the basis that any friend is better than none, although academics in my experience have always needed a shot of steel in their spines from time to time.

Below is a video recording of a meeting that Gilad Atzmon addressed (uninvited) in Stuttgart, Germany a couple of years ago. The following day Ali Abunimah of Electronic Intifada made it clear that Atzmon’s prescription – that Zionism & Palestinian oppression could be explained by ‘Jewish culture’ was about as helpful as looking to Afrikaaner culture for an explanation of Apartheid.

Tony Greenstein


Not Quite "Ordinary Human Beings" --
Anti-Imperialism & the Anti-Humanist Rhetoric of Gilad Atzmon

Attempting to latch onto the just, vital, and growing movement in support of the Palestinian national liberation struggle, Gilad Atzmon is one of a very small and unrepresentative group of writers who have argued (in agreement with many Zionists) that there is no meaningful distinction to be made between Jews in general and Israeli atrocities. According to Atzmon, the latter are simply a manifestation of Jews' historic relationship to gentiles, an authentic expression of an essentially racist, immoral, and anti-human "Jewish ideology."

Atzmon's statements, besides distorting the history of Jews and constituting a brazen justification for centuries of anti-Jewish behavior and beliefs, also downgrade anti-Zionism to a mere front in the broader (anti-Jewish) struggle. Atzmon has specifically described Zionism not as a form of colonialism or settlerism, but as a uniquely evil ideology unlike anything else in human history. In addition to any ethical problems, this line of argumentation actually strengthens Zionism's grip and claim to be the authentic representative of Jews. It obscures the reality that Zionism is an imperialist and colonialist enemy of Jewish people and Palestinians, as well as the Arab people generally and all those oppressed and exploited by imperialism.

In his online attack on Moshe Machover, an Israeli socialist and founder of the anti-Zionist group Matzpen, Atzmon states:

Machover's reading of Zionism is pretty trivial. "Israel," he says, is a "settler state." For Machover this is a necessary point of departure because it sets Zionism as a colonialist expansionist project. The reasoning behind such a lame intellectual spin is obvious. As long as Zionism is conveyed as a colonial project, Jews, as a people, should be seen as ordinary people. They are no different from the French and the English, they just happen to run their deadly colonial project in a different time.1

For Atzmon, such views are "pretty trivial" and "lame" because he holds that Jews are in fact radically different from the French and the English. Of the many quotes we could provide in this regard, here is a small sampling:2

In order to understand Israel's unique condition we must ask, "who are the Jews? What is Judaism and what is Jewishness?"3

'Zionism is a continuation of Jewish ideology.4

'The never-ending robbery of Palestine by Israel in the name of the Jewish people establishes a devastating spiritual, ideological, cultural and, obviously, practical continuum between the Judaic Bible and the Zionist project. The crux of the matter is simple yet disturbing: Israel and Zionism are both successful political systems that put into devastating practice the plunder promised by the Judaic God in the Judaic holy scriptures.'5

Sadly, we have to admit that hate-ridden plunder of other people's possessions made it into the Jewish political discourse both on the left and right. The Jewish nationalist would rob Palestine in the name of the right of self-determination, the Jewish progressive is there to rob the ruling class and even international capital in the name of world working class revolution.6

Were Jewish Marxists and cosmopolitans open to the notion of brotherhood, they would have given up on their unique, exclusive banners and become ordinary human beings like the rest of us.7

I do not consider the Jews to be a race, and yet it is obvious that "Jewishness" clearly involves an ethno-centric and racially supremacist, exclusivist point of view that is based on a sense of Jewish "chosen-ness."8

At the most, Israel has managed to mimic some of the appearances of a Western civilisation, but it has clearly failed to internalise the meaning of tolerance and freedom. This should not take us by surprise: Israel defines itself as a Jewish state, and Jewishness is, sadly enough, inherently intolerant; indeed, it may be argued that Jewish intolerance is as old as the Jews themselves.9

'Israel and Zionism then, has proved to be a short lived dream. It was initiated to civilise Jewish life, and to dismantle the Jewish self-destructive mode. It was there to move the Jew into the post-herem phase.10 It vowed to make the Jew into a productive being. But as things turned out, neither the Zionists nor the "anti Zionists" managed to drift away from the disastrous herem culture. It seems that the entire world of Jewish identity politics is a matrix of herems and exclusion strategies. In order to be "a proper Jew," all you have to do is to point out whom you oppose, hate, exclude or boycott.11

The conclusion to such views is not difficult to draw:

The endless trail of Jewish collective tragedies is there to teach us that Jews always pay eventually (and heavily) for Jewish power exercises. Yet, surprisingly (and tragically) enough, Jews somehow consistently fail to internalise and learn from that very lesson.12

More precisely, commenting on the climax of State violence directed at Jews in the 1930s, most famously by Germany, but also in most other European nations, Atzmon is clear:

The remarkable fact is they don't understand why the world is beginning to stand against them in the same way they didn't understand why the Europeans stood against them in the 1930s. Instead of asking why we are hated they continue to toss accusations on others.13

Within the discourse of Jewish politics and history there is no room for causality. There is no such a thing as a former and a latter. Within the Jewish tribal discourse every narrative starts to evolve when Jewish pain establishes itself. This obviously explains why Israelis and some Jews around the world can only think as far as "two state solution" within the framework of 1967 borders. It also explains why for most Jews the history of the holocaust starts in the gas chambers or with the rise of the Nazis. I have hardly seen any Israelis or Jews attempt to understand the circumstances that led to the clear resentment of Europeans towards their Jewish neighbors in the 1920's-40's.14

It is, as such, not surprising that Atzmon's work has received enthusiastic reviews by such prominent members of the racist right as former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke, Kevin MacDonald of the Occidental Observer, David Icke, and Arthur Topham's the Radical Press. It should not be surprising that Atzmon has distributed articles defending Holocaust deniers and those who write of "the Hitler we loved and why."15 These connections ultimately serve the interests of Zionism, which seeks to conflate anti-Zionism with anti-Jewishness. Zionist agents have repeatedly attempted to ensnare and link Palestinian, Arab, and/or Muslim rights advocates to Neo-Nazism, through dirty tricks and outright lies.

It is more surprising and disappointing, then, that a small section of the left has opted to promote Atzmon and his works. In the UK, the Socialist Workers Party promoted Atzmon for several years16 before finally breaking with him; his latest book The Wandering Who? has been published by the left-wing Zero Books (a decision that elicited a letter of protest from several Zero authors).17 In the United States, the widely-read Counterpunch website has repeatedly chosen to run articles by Atzmon. Currently, in February and March 2012, Atzmon is on tour in North America, where several of his speaking engagements are being organized by progressive anti-imperialists whom we would normally like to consider our allies.

While perhaps well-meaning, operating under the assumption that any opposition to Zionism is to be welcomed, progressives who promote the work of Atzmon are in fact surrendering the moral high ground by encouraging a belief-system that simply mirrors that of the most racist section of Israeli society. Anti-racism is not a liability; on the contrary, it is a principle that makes our movements stronger in the long fight for a better tomorrow.

As political activists committed to resisting colonialism and imperialism -- in North America and around the world -- we recognize that there can be different interpretations of history, and we welcome exploring these. Without wishing to debate the question of whether far-right and racist ideologues should be censored, or how, we see no reason for progressive people to organize events to promote their works.

In our struggle against Zionism, racism, and all forms of colonialism and imperialism, there is no place for anti-Semitism or the vilification of Jews, Palestinians, or any people based on their religions, cultures, nationalities, ethnicity, or history. At this historic junction -- when the need to struggle for the liberation of Palestine is more vital than ever and the fault lines of capitalist empire are becoming more widely exposed -- no anti-oppressive revolution can be built with ultra-right allies or upon foundations friendly to creeping fascism.

1 Gilad Atzmon, "Tribal Marxism for Dummies," originally published in June 2009, republished on his Web site on April 24, 2011.

2 Many more quotes like these could be provided, but we assume this is enough to show that these are not out-of-context or out-of-character remarks. If not, readers may wish to peruse the section of Atzmon's website on "Jewishness"

3 Gilad Atzmon, "Tribal Marxism for Dummies," Atlantic Free Press, July 2, 2009.

4 Anayat Durrani, "Exposing Dangerous Myths," Interview with Gilad Atzmon, originally published in Al-Ahram Weekly (May 19-25, 2011), republished on Atzmon's Web site on May 19, 2011.

5 Gilad Atzmon, "Swindler's List: Zionist Plunder and the Judaic Bible," Redress Information & Analysis, April 5, 2008.

6 Ibid.

7 Ibid.

8 Gilad Atzmon, "An Interesting Exchange With A Jewish Anti Zionist," Atzmon's Web site, August 17, 2011.

9 Gilad Atzmon, "The Herem Law in the context of Jewish Past and Present," Atzmon's Web site, July 16, 2011.

10 "Herem" is a Hebrew word that refers to banning or excluding someone; it is also the name of the repressive legislation Israel recently passed to enable punitive lawsuits against those calling for a boycott of the apartheid state. For Atzmon, this law is just one more example of Zionism's Jewish uniqueness (guess he never heard of SLAPPs), as he concludes that "this is what Jews do best: destroying, excluding, excommunicating, silencing, boycotting, sanctioning. After all, Jews have been doing this for centuries."

11 Ibid.

12 Gilad Atzmon, "A Warning From The Past," Atzmon's Web site, May 26, 2011.

13 Quoted in Shabana Syed, "Time for World to Confront Israel: Gilad Atzmon," Arab News, June 14, 2010.

14 Gilad Atzmon, "Jewish Ideology and World Peace," Atzmon's Web site, June 7, 2010.

15 "Gilad Atzmon, the SWP and Holocaust Denial," BobFromBrockley, June 13, 2005.

16 "Gilad Atzmon and the SWP: a Brief Chronology," BobFromBrockley, October 5, 2011.

17 "Zero Authors' Statement on Gilad Atzmon," Lenin's Tomb, September 26, 2011.

As'ad AbuKhalil, The Angry Arab News Service, Turlock CA
Max Ajl, essayist, rabble-rouser, proprietor of Jewbonics blog site, Ithaca NY
Electa Arenal, professor emerita, CUNY Graduate Center/Hispanic & Luso-Brazilian Literatures and Women's Studies, New York NY
Gabriel Ash, International Jewish Anti-Zionist Network, Geneva, SWITZERLAND
Dan Berger, Wild Poppies Collective, Philadelphia PA
Lenni Brenner, author, Zionism in the Age of the Dictator, New York NY
Susie Day, Monthly Review, New York NY
Todd Eaton, Park Slope Food Coop Members for Boycott/Divestment/Sanctions, Brooklyn NY
S. EtShalom, Registered Nurse, Philadelphia PA
Sherna Berger Gluck, Prof. Emerita, California State University/Israel Divestment Campaign, CA
Andrew Griggs, Café Intifada, Los Angeles CA
Ken Hiebert, activist, Ladysmith, Canada
Elizabeth Horowitz, solidarity activist, New York NY
Karl Kersplebedeb, Left Wing Books, Montreal, CANADA
Mark Klein, activist, Toronto, CANADA
Mark Lance, Georgetown University/Institute for Anarchist Studies, Washington DC
David Landy, author, Jewish Identity and Palestinian Rights: Diaspora Jewish Opposition to Israel, Dublin, IRELAND
Bob Lederer, Pacifica/WBAI producer, Queers Against Israeli Apartheid, New York NY
Matthew Lyons, Three Way Fight, Philadelphia PA
Karen MacRae, solidarity activist, Toronto, CANADA
Marvin Mandell and Betty Reid Mandell, co-editors, New Politics, West Roxbury MA
Matt Meyer, Resistance in Brooklyn, New York NY
Michael Novick, People Against Racist Terror/Anti-Racist Action, Los Angeles CA
Sylvia Posadas (Jinjirrie), Kadaitcha.com, Don't Play Apartheid Israel, Noosa, AUSTRALIA
Roland Rance, Jews Against Zionism, London, UK
Liz Roberts, War Resisters League, New York NY
Emma Rosenthal, contributor, Shifting Sands: Jewish Women Confront the Israeli Occupation, Los Angeles CA
Ian Saville, performer and lecturer, London, UK
Joel Schwartz, CSEA Local 446, AFSCME, New York NY
Simona Sharoni, SUNY, author, Gender & the Israeli-Palestinian Conflict, Plattsburgh NY
Abraham Weizfeld, author, The End of Zionism and the liberation of the Jewish People, Montreal, CANADA
Laura Whitehorn, former political prisoner, NYS Task Force on Political Prisoners, New York NY
Ben White, author, Palestinians in Israel: Segregation, Discrimination, and Democracy, Cambridge, UK

[slimmouse]

Has anyone tried talking to Atzmon from any of these groups who oppose him? Or have both sides got their heads up their asses?

What I would really appreciate any time soon is a recorded discussion between Greenstein and Atzmon.

And what I wouldnt give to be throwing out the questions

[American Dream]

Here are the contents of the article linked in the previous posting:

http://azvsas.blogspot.com/2011/12/mary ... g-out.html



Tuesday, 13 December 2011

Mary Rizzo & Gilad Atzmon - the Falling Out


Mary Rizzo on Gilad Atzmon

There has been much speculation as to why the alliance between Gilad Atzmon and Mary Rizzo broke up. The truth appears to now be out, it was entirely person!

Well they say the political is personal but I’ve yet to see any major political differences emerge although clearly there is one crucial distinction. Despite the fact that she ends up in a political marriage with racists like Israel Shamir and Gilad Atzmon, Mary Rizzo – who used to run the PeacePalestine site and then the Palestine Think Tank, undoubtedly supports the Palestinians. With Gilad Atzmon, everything takes second place to his ego.

For example, following an exchange with Atzmon on 30th July this year I wrote at one stage:
‘yes you're more popular than the Palestinians. Who knows. Maybe that's the way to victory! Quite what they've done to deserve your 'support' is another question.’ to which Atzmon replied, without a trace of his normal ‘humour’ that ‘It is indeed a matter of concern i agree,,, ‘

Mary Rizzo went to the lengths of the earth to court Atzmon. There was nothing she wouldn’t do for him. However it couldn’t last. Atzmon’s ego was too big even for Mary and it would appear that Atzmon took full advantage of her hero worship and bullied her until she finally upped and left.

The piece below is interesting for the light it shines on Atzmon’s behaviour to his followers behind the scenes: It also suggests that Atzmon is keeping company with an Israeli ‘informant’. As well as casting a not very favourable light on Atzmon’s ‘borrowings’ – such as that rumoured from Mahmoud Darwish, to whom he was allegedly haggling over royalties. The Tony Ms Rizzo is replying to is not myself!

Tony Greenstein


Author: Mary Rizzo
Comment:

Tony, there is so much JUNK in your comment, I wouldn't know where to begin. I will state a couple of things though that might help you out of your confusion. I used to be very close to Atzmon, but our friendship ended due to personality conflicts (I hate bossy people who at 9 am tell you one thing and at 9.30 are bitching at you because you haven't done the opposite of what they wanted... I can't keep up with that kind of personality. He was once a very funny and amiable person, but when he gets irritable, he is too unpleasant and life is short enough without people bossing you around. I wanted out and I especially wanted to be far away from a person who hung out with a person who was a known informant, though he insisted it could not be true, but I'd trust a Palestinian from Palestine before I would an Israeli from Israel any day of the week.) I also have avoided writing about him entirely, though folks have asked and asked and a lot of interesting stories have arisen out of people's speculation! However, I have read about 3 pieces by him in the past year, so I don't know what he's saying or writing these days. I can't imagine it's that much different! I can only say one thing; I ran accidentally into a comment of his that made me laugh out loud at how he views his "departure" from this site, and sooner or later, hope he will come to terms with the truth and facts, though it seems all of that is a variable in a lot of activists' worlds.

1) I don't think Gilad is Hungarian. He may or may not be related to the Atzmon you name, but he IS related to Tzipi Livni, which he openly states. He also is NO refugee (!!!!) in London. He went there for his career, liked it and stayed, like many Israelis do. He owns a lot of property there, is doing very well, so refugee is seriously the most mistaken word you can choose. I doubt he has anything at all to do with too many persons who will not benefit his career which is his priority. He also is very interested in his image as "a radical figure", so he does tend to repeat the same points he has for many years, as he can add on a handful at a time of new fans who had not yet heard the message in the first place. As to burning down synagogues, that one is an old line that actually has been placed firmly in context I don't know HOW many times in the past... he is no threat to Jews whatsoever. Indeed, he is judeocentric and always keeps Jews in the centre of the discourse as if they are the most interesting and important people on the planet. It gets tired quick, it just took me longer to get bored with the focus on them, since I realise they are not as important as he wishes to make them out (this is part of the whole "I am special" thing... it would take a shrink to really define it all correctly, or someone with a lot of time on their hands. To the rest of us, it gets a bit redundant!)

2) I don't think he writes for Veteran's Today. Like all the sites that publish him, he sends out a copy to everyone on his mailing list and some insert them all and also credit him as editor or contributor. He only puts stuff (or has someone put it for him) on his personal site. He was at one time an extremely close friend and also a co-founder of this site and editor/contributor. This means, after discussing his ideas and the news for a while each day on the phone with me, he'd then write a version of it which I would clean up and edit. If my changes were acceptable, he'd say, good. I'd find artwork, fact check, link test, etc., format it, give it a title, set it up, circulate it, get it sent for translation, then it would go elsewhere. He does not ever like to credit things that people give to him, (he thinks he deserves it, I suppose) and I even saw him once claim credit for the name of his spoof band, The Promised Band, which I thought of, and he did not even blush when people were complimenting him at how clever that was. It seems he tends to take a lot of stuff and then assimilate it and believe it actually is his own invention. He's a good musician, at times can be funny, but let's say, sometimes his best lines come from other people....

At a certain point, I stopped wanting to do all that free work for various reasons, which you can maybe begin to understand..., and Haitham and I asked him to be more cooperative with the group effort or leave. He has been saying he left due to lack of shared political ideas, but that's bunk. It was that he didn't want to accept the 3 tiny conditions we gave because I was fed up with his constant bitching: 1) find someone else to do the actual editing work, since I had no time or interest for it anymore, at least in the short term, as I was physically ill, 2) circulate once a month any article by anyone except himself, 3) stop insulting people on comments because as the person moderating them, I could not accept his name calling of commenters and block others from doing the same to him. He said (even though a normal editor would actually realise these conditions were the bare minimum to cooperate with other busy people who also wanted to focus on their own writing and promoting some more writers and translate more Palestinian writers) "I don't take conditions!" so, we dropped him. We later "hid" his articles and kept them stored in archives along with all the comments because he started to publish them without crediting PTT, which we told him was not correct and could not be accepted. So, that is the Gilad Story with PTT.

As an Israeli, he has a right to invent his own narrative like "he left due to the political differences", as actually, this site has always been the same and it's pretty clear to anyone who does not have a weird agenda: ie., it's Patriotic to Palestinen, Arab Nationalist, accepts the primacy of the Palestinian voice, critical of anyone in activism who is making their work "the Solidarity Industry" (making money or fame off of the misery of another people), intolerant of gatekeepers, respectful of the diversity of Palestinian society, (secular, religious, socialist, whatever, it does not matter one iota, as long as the persons support and seek the full ROR and liberation from zionist occupation, they will have space to be heard here and to have their thoughts freely expressed and discussed, no matter how critical of any other faction or party. Palestinian society is diverse and varied, and this is how it will remain. Discussion and dissent is encouraged at all times, not gatekept or punished.

Discussion on a site like this allows anyone to freely hold any particular religious belief, because it doesn't matter what someone believes unless they use it as a wedge to divide. Gilad himself started telling me it was fine to have religious people express, but I should "shut up" on my own views, since in his mind it would drive Palestinians away if they were not getting the lip service about Islam, also culminating in him promoting some "Muslim scholar" also famous for pimping the Iraq war!! That was unacceptable, though we allowed it... PTT was not gatekeeping one of its editors.

But PTT can't support admitting any kind of intolerance to people's beliefs. I respect those who believe, just as I expect those who believe to respect my own beliefs! Any gatekeeping of that kind is not acceptable and this was also a position shared by my contacts who are actually DOING resistance in Lebanon and Palestine. They saw the whole thing as his sucking up and asked me what that was about. I could only shrug my shoulders. I only hope he has grown out of his drive to feed a culture clash since nobody but the neocons and the fanatics want it. He invented the narrative that he left and asked us to remove his content. well, "If it makes you happy, Gilad! say what you want. We know the truth and so do you!" <we have all the emails>

3) VT is an odd combination of people, let me just say that. Some are ok, they seem ok, others I have no idea about. They are American Patriots, so what they print will reflect that, obviously. If they are now busy slamming Wikileaks, I don't know what to say.. I haven't seen any evidence, just speculation, but I don't read that site, I find it pretty useless and repetitive. Some writers there, though, I've had some good discussions with and consider as friendly acquaintances. My personal radar though happened about a year ago, long before they started to attack me -if they are, I actually haven't checked, and if Salem News attacks me, I laugh. They have published some junk pieces that can line a litter box for how full they are of bad (and I mean BAD) journalism, with zero due diligence, zero fact checking (even a title they had to change because they don't check a basic fact... That the editor gets angry when I mention he was embedded, says it all.. HE is the guy who admits it, it's evidently fine with him). But VT has Jeff Gates (who also contributes here... but I am reading his stuff with a fine tooth comb these days) who actually had endorse his book that looked like it came out of the Republican Party Economic Plan no less that Amitai Etzioni. So, if a person writes a book on the Jewish lobby and has Etzioni pimp his previous book, can I rightly assume he really is as up to scratch on the lobby as he wants us to believe? I dunno... maybe he is? All I can say is, my antennae went up a few notches.

4) the word Goyim is used by Jews to mean "non-Jews"... I don't understand your fit you are having over it.

5) I have decided, there is no such thing as an ex-mil who is REALLY ex. Some have an agenda, I am still trying to figure out what it is. I do know that every single one of them KNOW things they dare not actually state, such as what daddy does for a living and how this impacts REALLY the Palestinians. Things like that I hope one day they can really look in the mirror and say... I should have done what my heart prevented me from doing, but I didn't... family and tribe came first. I hope I can be forgiven for being such a fake.

but I don't count on it.

Just like I don't believe any real narcissist has a grasp on how others do see him, and that is what makes it actually rather funny.

[seemslikeadream]

love the blame game...dishin it out ...



Meet Captain Israel, the anti-BDS superhero
Creators of a new comic hope that they can counter the 'venomous' Israel boycott movement.
tell me again who's doin' the most damage to who?

[justdrew]

Has anyone tried talking to Atzmon from any of these groups who oppose him? Or have both sides got their heads up their asses?

What's to talk about? Atzmon might as well come out and say "the protocols are real" - whatever "fight" he wants to have with jews should not be associated with. Does ANYONE really think his philosophizing is going to achieve any possible good end?

Keep in mind these sorts of Trojan Horses will say some attractive things from time to time, that is their M.O. - but their occasional spoon full of sugar just helps the poison go down.

His apparent desire to see the entire multifaceted structure of "jewishness" dismantled and everyone (this is clearly recommended to everyone not just jews) assimilated into "brotherhood" is exactly non-sense. A diversity of multiple particularities is our goal, not some global monoculture of illusionary brotherhood.

[seemslikeadream]

Has anyone tried talking to Atzmon from any of these groups who oppose him? Or have both sides got their heads up their asses?

What's to talk about? Atzmon might as well come out and say "the protocols are real" - whatever "fight" he wants to have with jews should not be associated with. Does ANYONE really think his philosophizing is going to achieve any possible good end?

Keep in mind these sorts of Trojan Horses will say some attractive things from time to time, that is their M.O. - but their occasional spoon full of sugar just helps the poison go down.

His apparent desire to see the entire multifaceted structure of "jewishness" dismantled and everyone (this is clearly recommended to everyone not just jews) assimilated into "brotherhood" is exactly non-sense. A diversity of multiple particularities is our goal, not some global monoculture of illusionary brotherhood.

but it's AD that continues to tell one side of the story and the conveniently forgets anything else...and loves to falsely equate one with another...that's why the push back

I've never seen him start a thread about Captain Israel Reptilian theory

[slimmouse]

You know something.....I listened to a long interview with Atzmon last night that came highly recommended and I have to say that having listened to it, I wasn't over impressed.

The funny thing is that having read ADs latest post on Atzmon by his ex, I would readily confess it truly matched my own mental profile of how Atzmon might be if one had to live with him.

Meanwhile, the relationship with the known informant needs both confrirming or denying by either side also.

Thanks for that reply AD.

[slimmouse]

Has anyone tried talking to Atzmon from any of these groups who oppose him? Or have both sides got their heads up their asses?

What's to talk about? Atzmon might as well come out and say "the protocols are real" - whatever "fight" he wants to have with jews should not be associated with. Does ANYONE really think his philosophizing is going to achieve any possible good end?

Keep in mind these sorts of Trojan Horses will say some attractive things from time to time, that is their M.O. - but their occasional spoon full of sugar just helps the poison go down.

His apparent desire to see the entire multifaceted structure of "jewishness" dismantled and everyone (this is clearly recommended to everyone not just jews) assimilated into "brotherhood" is exactly non-sense. A diversity of multiple particularities is our goal, not some global monoculture of illusionary brotherhood.

Drew, you have made a truly well considered reply here, which deserves absolute respect.

I would however probably be more baffled by the fact that the vast majority of the UK Govnt are apparently "friends of Israel" were it not for how his understandings or how belonging to the cult of Judaism is responsible for this to a not inconsiderable degree.

One things for sure, If Israel didnt exist, then some truly smart whilst at the same time sad fuickers would have had to have invented her.

And Im 100% certain that they aint Jewish.

[Searcher08]

Captain Israel Reptilian Theory.

Tripsoff the tongue, doesnt it?
The enemies of Israel are 4 Dimensional Lizards from Orion led by Junior Annunaki Tony "Dont leave your credit card with me" Greenstein.

What is your defense of Captain Israel Reptilian Theory, AD?