JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby fruhmenschen » Sat Oct 19, 2013 12:14 pm

see link for full story

http://www.olneydailymail.com/article/2 ... /1001/NEWS

One of the speakers , Ed Tatro is a friend who we brought to speak at Bates College.
He scripted the banned History Channel documentary THE GUILTY MEN and appears in the program.





Olney Central College will host two-day conference on JFK assassination
OCC instructor David Denton has organized event

Posted Oct. 17, 2013 @ 5:24 pm

Olney, Ill. —

This year marks the 50th anniversary of President John F. Kennedy's assassination. This month Olney Central College will host a free two-day conference, which will bring together nationally-known academics, scholars and authors to lend their perspectives on the events leading up to and following that fateful day in Dallas.

Nearly five decades after Kennedy's death, questions and speculation continue to surround the assassination. OCC instructor and conference organizer David Denton said the event — Changing the Historical Reality of November 22, 1963 — will explore the idea that the version of history put forth by the Warren Commission is untenable.

Denton said the conference speakers will present factual evidence, which questions the Warren Commission's conclusions and offers a different historical reality that takes into account the forces, which were aligned against Kennedy. The presenters also will explore the potential means, motive, opportunity and connections, as well as who benefited the most from the president's death.

The conference will be held from noon to 9 p.m. on Friday, Oct. 25 and from 10 a.m. to 7:20 p.m. on Saturday, Oct. 26 in the Dr. John D. Stull Performing Arts Center. Both evenings will conclude with a reception, which will give participants the opportunity to interact with the speakers.

"The conference is open to the public and we encourage anyone who is interested in that period of our history to attend," Denton said. "We will talk about the basic evidence, facts and witnesses in the case as well as the controversial elements such as the Secret Service protection, the autopsy of the president and the motives and means of opportunity of people who may have been involved."

Although the Warren Commission concluded in its 1964 report Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone in killing Kennedy, Denton said the vast majority of Americans have always believed otherwise and the weight of the evidence confirms their doubts.



Denton, who also is a conference speaker, will discuss the Secret Service as well as the CIA. Other presenters include Douglas P. Horne, Edgar F. Tatro, Phillip F. Nelson, Dennis David, Rick Russo, James Wagenvoord and Judyth Vary Baker.

Horne served on the staff of the Assassination Records Review Board (ARRB) from August 1995 to September 1998. His most important work on the ARRB staff was the assistance he provided to the General Counsel in conducting all 10 sworn depositions of key personnel who conducted, or witnessed, President Kennedy's military autopsy at Bethesda Naval Hospital on Nov. 22, 1963. In 2009, he published the five-volume encyclopedic work Inside the Assassination Records Review Board: The U.S. Government's Final Attempt to Reconcile the Conflicting Medical Evidence in the Assassination of JFK — a frank and extremely detailed discussion of the evidence of the U.S. government's cover-up in 1963 and 1964 of the medical evidence surrounding JFK's assassination.

Tatro is a long-time educator, who has taught college and adult education courses for 30 years, specializing in the JFK assassination. He is the author of many research articles pertaining to the assassination conspiracy. His work has been acknowledged or footnoted in many JFK assassination books. Tatro served as a minor consultant to Oliver Stone's film, "JFK," and is acknowledged in JFK: The Book of the Film by Oliver Stone and Zachary Sklar.

Tatro is the original editor of Texas in the Morning, the memoirs of LBJ's mistress, Madeleine Duncan Brown, and editor of the Bugliosi Chapter in Biting the Elephant by Dr. Rodger Remington. He contributed research to Sen. Sam Ervin's Watergate investigative committee and the House Select Committee on Assassinations.

He was a consultant to Nigel Turner's "The Truth Shall Set You Free" and "The Smoking Guns," parts six and seven of The Men Who Killed Kennedy series. He was a primary recruiter and participant in Turner's "The Guilty Men," part nine of the same series.
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby Forgetting2 » Sat Oct 19, 2013 12:42 pm

Anyone know what's up with Judyth Vary Baker? I heard her complaining about being shut out from one of the Dallas events...
You know what you finally say, what everybody finally says, no matter what? I'm hungry. I'm hungry, Rich. I'm fuckin' starved. -- Cutter's Way
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby Carol Newquist » Sat Oct 19, 2013 1:11 pm

To the book critics who have me all figured out and want to protect me from myself -- I'll choose my literary poison, thank you.


Would it be fair to say that you consider Tosches unfair in his treatment of JFK since JFK is dead.....and a horrible death, at that?

So let me get this straight. You prefer to read books that are unfair? Or is it that I'm unfair, but a recognized author you might favor isn't and couldn't be? Help me clear up what seems like a contradiction.

Lewis was, and is, a smug, philandering jackass. What I did was in no way unfair to his smarmy ass. Did I like some of his movies? Yes, I did, but I'm not a fanboy, so he doesn't get a pass when ladling out just desserts.
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby Project Willow » Sat Oct 19, 2013 2:16 pm

^Carol, please state your opinion about any one subject or another without getting into personal characterizations about posters who hold other opinions, even if they are questions. Just, don't go there. If you want to be engaged in debate and conversation that doesn't lead to more flame wars, that's the key.

To clarify, if you think the book in question is unfair, it's really easy to plainly say so, without calling into question Elvis's general reading habits or judgement, which is an entirely non-productive approach.
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby Carol Newquist » Sat Oct 19, 2013 3:22 pm

^Project Willow, I don't think the book is unfair, and I don't think my ripping Lewis is unfair. That makes me consistent. Elvis said I was unfair, and yet thanked WR for introducing him to the book as though it would be a good read for him. Applying his logic that my satirical stab at Lewis is unfair considering the book he wants to read also skewers Lewis and the rest of the Mad Men is not consistent. It's using a double-standard in applying the characterization of unfair. Elvis is inconsistent and I'm consistent. I want him to see his inconsistency and admit it, if he can. He started it by saying I was unfair, and I want him to admit his irony. If he won't, or can't, fine, but how about you advise him as part of this to not make ironical characterizations of me. That would only be fair, right? He could have avoided making the unfair comment. My well-deserved jab at Lewis was not directed at Elvis, so why did he feel a need to defend the bozo and call my statement unfair?
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby Project Willow » Sat Oct 19, 2013 3:48 pm

You're not hearing me, Carol. I'll remind you again to keep your comments squarely focused on the subject matter, that is, state your ideas, thoughts, opinions about the subject matter, and refrain from targeting the characters or behaviors of other posters.
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby peartreed » Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:10 pm

It’s easy to harshly judge JFK, RFK and the rest of the high profile politicians, as well as the successful celebrities in the “Rat Pack” based on revelations of their personal conduct, or misconduct, against the prevailing moral standards and even higher expectations of them. The penetrating public spotlight exposes even private parts.

In my second career in the film industry I worked closely with performers in all categories, including famous people who I interacted with “behind the screens”. Take away the wonderstruck worshippers of their work and roles and marketed images, they are also people, just like everyone else, with common temptations.

A distinction is that their celebrity and success comes with incredible income and the opportunity to move in elite circles that can afford hedonistic pleasures with a willing, star-struck fan base and the predatory, pimping world of producers and politicos manipulating them for a share of the limelight.

While we endow them with admiration, adulation and emotional identification with their superhuman status, we expect in return the delivery of divine discipline deserving of our devotion. When they fail and fall from grace we turn vicious at the betrayal of our dreams, fantasies and vicarious investment in their value as icons.

Some seriously disenchanted among their former champions then feel entitled to take their raw outrage at the revelations of basic, realistic human frailties as a license and justification to destroy what may be left of their legacy and lure. It is akin to religious reverence transforming into riveting repulsion and revenge. It can become a no-holds-barred barrage of bitter badmouthing – and cruel commentary in accord with the degree of disappointment, devastation and shattered dreams.

The publishing world is one of the few to profit from prurient interest in pathos.

Armchair arbiters of egregious evil will join the bandwagon of bellicose blame.

But how would we react to heady idolatry, inflated ego, immense riches and the rare opportunity to indulge all our vices and secret fantasies?

I think we create our own devils, and we reveal ourselves when our angels fall. A little empathy is earned, especially by the admired.
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby fruhmenschen » Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:14 pm

Forgetting2 » Sat Oct 19, 2013 12:42 pm wrote:Anyone know what's up with Judyth Vary Baker? I heard her complaining about being shut out from one of the Dallas events...


Judy Judy Judy, I hear you are speaking in Ohio.

see link for full story

http://www.olneydailymail.com/article/2 ... /1001/NEWS

One of the speakers , Ed Tatro is a friend who we brought to speak at Bates College.
He scripted the banned History Channel documentary THE GUILTY MEN and appears in the program.





Olney Central College will host two-day conference on JFK assassination
OCC instructor David Denton has organized event

Posted Oct. 17, 2013 @ 5:24 pm

Olney, Ill. —

This year marks the 50th anniversary of President John F. Kennedy's assassination. This month Olney Central College will host a free two-day conference, which will bring together nationally-known academics, scholars and authors to lend their perspectives on the events leading up to and following that fateful day in Dallas.

Nearly five decades after Kennedy's death, questions and speculation continue to surround the assassination. OCC instructor and conference organizer David Denton said the event — Changing the Historical Reality of November 22, 1963 — will explore the idea that the version of history put forth by the Warren Commission is untenable.

Denton said the conference speakers will present factual evidence, which questions the Warren Commission's conclusions and offers a different historical reality that takes into account the forces, which were aligned against Kennedy. The presenters also will explore the potential means, motive, opportunity and connections, as well as who benefited the most from the president's death.

The conference will be held from noon to 9 p.m. on Friday, Oct. 25 and from 10 a.m. to 7:20 p.m. on Saturday, Oct. 26 in the Dr. John D. Stull Performing Arts Center. Both evenings will conclude with a reception, which will give participants the opportunity to interact with the speakers.

"The conference is open to the public and we encourage anyone who is interested in that period of our history to attend," Denton said. "We will talk about the basic evidence, facts and witnesses in the case as well as the controversial elements such as the Secret Service protection, the autopsy of the president and the motives and means of opportunity of people who may have been involved."

Although the Warren Commission concluded in its 1964 report Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone in killing Kennedy, Denton said the vast majority of Americans have always believed otherwise and the weight of the evidence confirms their doubts.



Denton, who also is a conference speaker, will discuss the Secret Service as well as the CIA. Other presenters include Douglas P. Horne, Edgar F. Tatro, Phillip F. Nelson, Dennis David, Rick Russo, James Wagenvoord and Judyth Vary Baker.

Horne served on the staff of the Assassination Records Review Board (ARRB) from August 1995 to September 1998. His most important work on the ARRB staff was the assistance he provided to the General Counsel in conducting all 10 sworn depositions of key personnel who conducted, or witnessed, President Kennedy's military autopsy at Bethesda Naval Hospital on Nov. 22, 1963. In 2009, he published the five-volume encyclopedic work Inside the Assassination Records Review Board: The U.S. Government's Final Attempt to Reconcile the Conflicting Medical Evidence in the Assassination of JFK — a frank and extremely detailed discussion of the evidence of the U.S. government's cover-up in 1963 and 1964 of the medical evidence surrounding JFK's assassination.

Tatro is a long-time educator, who has taught college and adult education courses for 30 years, specializing in the JFK assassination. He is the author of many research articles pertaining to the assassination conspiracy. His work has been acknowledged or footnoted in many JFK assassination books. Tatro served as a minor consultant to Oliver Stone's film, "JFK," and is acknowledged in JFK: The Book of the Film by Oliver Stone and Zachary Sklar.

Tatro is the original editor of Texas in the Morning, the memoirs of LBJ's mistress, Madeleine Duncan Brown, and editor of the Bugliosi Chapter in Biting the Elephant by Dr. Rodger Remington. He contributed research to Sen. Sam Ervin's Watergate investigative committee and the House Select Committee on Assassinations.

He was a consultant to Nigel Turner's "The Truth Shall Set You Free" and "The Smoking Guns," parts six and seven of The Men Who Killed Kennedy series. He was a primary recruiter and participant in Turner's "The Guilty Men," part nine of the same series.
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby Elvis » Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:16 pm

Carol Newquist » Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:11 am wrote:
To the book critics who have me all figured out and want to protect me from myself -- I'll choose my literary poison, thank you.


Would it be fair to say that you consider Tosches unfair in his treatment of JFK since JFK is dead.....and a horrible death, at that?

So let me get this straight. You prefer to read books that are unfair? Or is it that I'm unfair, but a recognized author you might favor isn't and couldn't be? Help me clear up what seems like a contradiction.


These questions don't follow from anything that preceeded or anything I wrote. You've compared yourself favorably with Nick Tosches but I haven't. If you are Nick Tosches, I regret the confusion.
"It seems to be what we have now is a political system which has essentially become, for the last thirty or forty years, a war on the human imagination."
(David Graeber)
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby Elvis » Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:35 pm

Robert Morningstar's interpretation of Officer Tippit's part in the day's events -- a role perhaps played mainly as a corpse -- I think is worth a close look. The gist is, that Tippit strongly resembled JFK, and that his body and/or his autopsy photos were, at one time or another, switched with those of JFK.

Link and quick paste, graphics at link:

http://www.redicecreations.com/article.php?id=17710
The Ultimate JFK Secret: Who is REALLY Buried In Arlington?
2011 11 25
By Robert D. Morningstar | JFKResearch.com

The JFK-Tippit Double Murder

"The killing of Officer Tippit is the Rosetta Stone of the JFK assassination"
~Wesley J. Leibeler, Warren Commission counsel

At the Third Decade conference, at a panel of the country’s foremost experts on the Kennedy assassination, I inquired whether anyone there had ever considered the possibility that we might be seeing rear view photos and X-rays of Tippit substituted for those of JFK, based on the amazing similarity of the temporal head wound in both victims. Some cynics laughed in the audience but from the podium, the moderator, George Michael Evica, author of "...And We Are All Mortal", responded with a most unusual answer:

"It’s interesting that you should ask this question because...I’ve studied Tippit, and when I went down to Dallas I found out that Tippit bore a remarkable resemblance to President Kennedy, so much so that HIS FRIENDS IN THE DALLAS POLICE DEPARTMENT USED TO RIB HIM AND CALL HIM ’JACK’ AND ’JFK’". (emphasis mine)

I then inquired whether anyone had ever seen any pictures of Tippit other than the one I had dubbed "The Tippit-Elvis Picture," which showed him in a cowboy shirt, head slightly tilted, hair slicked back, appearing to be about 26-28 years of age. To my knowledge, it was the only one that had been published since his death. I also inquired whether anyone there had ever seen Tippit’s autopsy report or knew his personal history. Later, Dan Du Pont, a researcher from North Hollywood, CA, approached me to discuss my inquiry. He promised to send me a copy of Tippit’s autopsy report to assist in my research.

THE REAL SECRET OF THE TIPPIT MURDER

In late July of 1992, I received from Dan Du Pont a 1964 manuscript by Gary Murr entitled "The Death of Officer J. D. Tippit". It contained the report of FBI Special Agent Arthur Carter on the autopsy of Officer J. D. Tippit, conducted by the Texas Coroner, Dr. Earl Rose. While studying the entry wound diagrams by Dr. Rose, I saw a remarkable similarity between Dr. Rose’s Tippit diagrams and the wound I perceived in the purported JFK lateral x-ray. I realized that the lateral x-ray purported to be that of the late President might in fact be that of Officer J. D. Tippit.

etc.
"It seems to be what we have now is a political system which has essentially become, for the last thirty or forty years, a war on the human imagination."
(David Graeber)
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby mulebone » Sun Oct 20, 2013 1:41 am

Carol, a word of advice...step very lightly. These people are incredibly serious about removing anything that resembles normal human interaction from their forum. They prefer neat little labeled compartments for their blocks of text.
In my opinion, for all their humanist rhetoric, I think actual breathing smelly & irrational humans scare the living fuck out of the lot of them.

That's why they hide here.

Behind the skirts of their momerators.

On many levels it's pathetically sad.

On other levels it is fucking hilarious. Grown men yelling out for the moderator when they feel insulted or inserting explanations for their statements because they're terrified that they'll get exiled from this burial mound of dead paragraphs.
Geez, I'd die of shame. For what it's worth Carol, I've spent the last 16 years raising 4 kids so I think I've learned to recognize toddler behavior when I see it.

Oddly enough though, they're quite capricious about who they toss off. For example, they probably killed Hugh by revoking his soap box, but someone like me, who has been banned in the past & who has never given a shit one way or the other about it - I've never emailed any of them, I've never ingratiated myself to them, I've never promised to never ever do it again - I get reinstated. It really makes no sense.

I won't even bother getting into the mental health issues on display here or the legions of self professed feminist men who appear to have spent very little time with any living & breathing women, spouting rhetoric as inane as any misogynist. I suspect that most of these men are utterly inept at seduction, preferring the sneakier, more ingratiating "friend" entrance in to a woman's panties.

Make no mistake though, if you're on the right side of the RI divide, you can institute personal attacks as much as you want, but if you find, as I suspect you're finding, that you're on the wrong side of the divide, you'll be encouraged to "stick to the topic" & "refrain from personal attacks."

After that comes the ruler across the knuckles & a stern dressing down by dad.

Ho fucking hum.

O me o my, it appears I've strayed waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay off topic. I'd better rectify that:

Kennedy was blah de blah de blah & someone shot him blah de blah de blah & they're probably all dead now blah de blah de blah & I can honestly say that I don't give a shit blah de blah de Kennedy de blah de Tippitt de blah de blah.....
Well Robert Moore went down heavy
With a crash upon the floor
And over to his thrashin' body
Betty Coltrane she did crawl.
She put the gun to the back of his head
And pulled the trigger once more
And blew his brains out
All over the table.
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby Project Willow » Sun Oct 20, 2013 2:11 am

^ Hey, Mulebone, come back when you feel able to conduct yourself appropriately without insulting the company. Not only is personally insulting an entire group of people with whom you wish to communicate not a normal behavior, it's a highly ineffective strategy, that is, if you actually want folks to listen to what you have to say.
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby peartreed » Sun Oct 20, 2013 2:29 pm

There are contrarians whose allergy to authority evidences itself in arrested development, unnecessary aggression and opposition to anything parental. They manifest that immaturity and beaten child belligerence in all its rebellious forms and at all ages because their progress as individuals remains simply juvenile. Perversely, they also see power as macho dominance and threatening violence since it’s the only familiar foundation of their fears.

Pop psychology and amateur child psychiatry aside, such self-appointed rebels still seek social acceptance among like-minded social dissidents and deviants, and will rally to the side of other obnoxious obstructionists in order to defy any decorum and demand for social compliance to standard ethical, moral or judicial rules. They celebrate and flaunt their social rejection as the only flag that will fly in other faces and bring them the secretly craved attention they lacked during their childhood.

JFK came to symbolize everything they detest: power, privilege, admiration, wealth, sophistication, maturity and all the other measurements of hierarchal success. It’s no wonder that social rejects in many guises and roles aligned to bring him down.

BTW I’ve always wondered about the big word, “Antidisestablishmentarianism” because it sounds like it might apply to this subject. But I’m often wrong too.
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby smiths » Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:19 pm

to go slightly off-topic, but to keep it in the realm of propaganda (which JFK killing certainly constituted)

this one's for Carol and Mulebone


'accusation in a mirror'

This consists in imputing to the opponents one's own intentions, i.e. the actions which one is planning oneself.
The advantages of accusation in a mirror are numerous.
Apart from the (undeserved) saintly image one gains (Outre l'aureole que l'on en retire a contrario), one deprives the enemy of his arguments and develops in the listeners and naive souls the conviction that, in the face of such opponents, honest people find themselves acting in self-defence, and everyone should support the "just cause"'.
In other words, 'accusation in a mirror' is a propaganda technique in which the perpetrators of certain actions ascribe those actions to their enemies and see their own actions as self-defence.



and then to steer back onto topic

the secret service stand down video did it for me, once i had seen that i never again gave serious thought to Mafia, Russian, Cubans, Lone Gunmans in any way except as aspects of Team Patsy
the question is why, who, why, what, why, when, why and why again?
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Re: JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why it Matters

Postby fruhmenschen » Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:46 pm

I still feel the FBI has not gotten enough credit for assassinating President Kennedy Pittsburgh FBI agent Orsini did his best to silence Dr Cyril Wecht a few years ago, eh? google orsini wecht fbi


Subject: A Great Conference on the JFK Assassination-- The Future of Freedom Foundation BEST CONFERENCE IN 20 YEARS
Date: Mon, 21 Oct 2013 18:24:31 -0400

http://fff.org/2013/10/21/a-great-confe ... niversity/
or
http://tinyurl.com/qfr4mt9
This completely sold out conference was a 5 Star Event, conducted by Cyril Wecht, at Duquesne University in Pittsburgh, run by Ben Wecht, Debbie and staff, and was flawless. There is a link to the program inside this review by Jacob Hornberger.
Moreover, for the first time under one roof, in the book room were exhibits by COPA, Coalition On Political Assassinations, displaying their “Hidden History Museum” concept, as well as JFK Lancer-- November in Dallas, both registering researchers for their upcoming Dallas Conferences next month.
COPA www.politicalassassinations.com
JFK Lancer www.jfklancer.com
Also were Walt Brown, who recently completed his JFK Chronology consisting of 32,000 pages on a single digital disk, Rex Bradford & the Mary Ferrell Foundation had the new edition of the late Gaeton Fonzi’s masterpiece, “The Last Investigation”, [which sold out the first day] with a new introduction and forward by Marie Fonzi, who also asked the publisher to do an audio version, which has Gaeton’s voice speaking at the beginning, (a first according to Skyhorse Publishing).
Dr. Cyril Wecht made one of his wonderful passionate speeches, confirming the progress that we have made in the past, with the enactment of the JFK Act, which released millions of documents providing some transparency to the assassination. In addition to attempting the release of remaining documents, Wecht stated that there are not enough young people investigating this case, which was also echoed by Oliver Stone. Since the case is an open murder case in the Dallas Police Department (Cold Case), we must now work on REOPENING THE CASE in the future.
I suggest that perhaps we should supplant the original “Free The Files” 4 inch buttons, seen in 1993, with “Reopen the JFK Case” in 2013. There is no statute of limitations in a murder case. Most Americans have no idea that the case was never closed, in the City of Dallas.
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