Masculinities of the far right

[American Dream]

What I am interested in is seeing that this continue to be a board where the same old standards continue to hold true:

This is an anti-fascist board. Propagation of fascist, neo-Nazi and "white pride" causes, including sympathetically linking to sites which advocate such, will not be permitted. This includes revisionist histories of the Holocaust.

This is an anti-sexist board. We correctly assume that women, as a group, have been and continue to be the object of oppression based upon their gender. It is expected that members will respect the rights of women to justice and equality in all spheres of life, and to a positive experience of RI. Contending that feminism is a "New World Order plot" will not be permitted.

Posts advocating violence, or espousing hatred of a people based upon race, religion, gender or sexuality, are not permitted.

[Belligerent Savant]

.

You Andy Kaufman motherfucker. I love it.

Blasphemer! Please do not give AD more credit than s/he can ever earn. Kaufman must surely be wondering why his ears are ringing while in full incognito garb somewhere not too far away. His ears should not be ringing.

Allow me to offer a more apt comparison (in my view, at least):

[seemslikeadream]

has there been a recent influx of undesirables?.....is there a reason we need to be reminded of our mission here?

[Belligerent Savant]

.

Every/anyone can be undesirable to another, in one form or another.

The witch hunt is on... again.

[Agent Orange Cooper]

Amusing how AD is accusing someone of being fascist for just discussing right-wing issues while simultaneously in another thread promoting an ideology that has far more in common with the fascist right-wing than anything being said in this thread (male domination over female bodies, language, spaces, etc).

[Elvis]

I'm pointing out that the current right wing is very weak and ineffectual and needs to get rid all of previous baggage, stop focusing on othering and instead focus on it's spiritual conflict that has created the problems it is now in. Fascists as a general rule are exceptionally materialistic and avoid spirituality like the plague.

This makes perfect sense to me. It's not fascism, it's a prescription for transcending it (so it seems to me).

[slomo]

What I am interested in is seeing that this continue to be a board where the same old standards continue to hold true:

This is an anti-fascist board. Propagation of fascist, neo-Nazi and "white pride" causes, including sympathetically linking to sites which advocate such, will not be permitted. This includes revisionist histories of the Holocaust.

This is an anti-sexist board. We correctly assume that women, as a group, have been and continue to be the object of oppression based upon their gender. It is expected that members will respect the rights of women to justice and equality in all spheres of life, and to a positive experience of RI. Contending that feminism is a "New World Order plot" will not be permitted.

Posts advocating violence, or espousing hatred of a people based upon race, religion, gender or sexuality, are not permitted.

[jakell]

This brings up 2 points:

1. There is a small schism in the WN community over whether or not the "war of wombs" is enough to win.. anything. They've lost the media, they've lost the culture war, they've lost their touch with the spiritual and now see religion almost solely as a socially useful device rather than communion with the divine. What do they have left? I've mentioned this elsewhere, but the demographic change leading to whites becoming a minority has much more to do with some economic factors (cost of raising a family),birth control and ultimately a spiritual crisis. This contrasts to the "jewish propaganda" or some other goofy line WNs tend to fallback on instead of considering the incentives, burdens and spirit of the culture. This othering misses the point, which is that the real struggle starts with an internal spiritual journey they must overcome to move forward. The minority status could be easily reversed in a few generations, and that's without an Operation Wetback 2.0.

2. The "no enemies to the right" stance is being tested constantly. What the alt-right desperately needs is an internal civil war. No truly right wing culture can be forged in absence of conflict, without this it is a loose set of ties bonded together only by shallow lifestyle choices. It is ultimately up to the alt-right to destroy the last vestiges of the old right wing order to bring something newer and stronger to life. This includes the GOP, what little "White Nationalism" still exists in the US, Christian Evangelists, Zionists, all must be consumed for a new culture to be born from the weakness and sterility of the current one.

From this conflict new bonds and shared understanding can be created. The 14 words is a useless salve for the spiritual conflict that is ahead of them. WNs ultimately have a vision of a peaceful and safe utopia in their minds but to forge the future they must abandon their desire for peace and safety and focus on annihilating each other. All of the lines to safety must be cut, there must be no way back. That is the heroes journey and it is a spiritual one.

This 'schism'** has been a little easier to define on this side of the Atlantic.

Here, White Nationalists and 'The New Right' can be seen seen as ideologically similar (for now), and the old right wing order that needs to be destroyed is British Nationalism as represented by the BNP and NF. This has noticeably already happened though as both those parties are now shadows of their former selves.
I would expect this to be mirrored to varying degrees in other European countries where there are traditional nationalisms that can be contrasted to white nationalism.


** I use inverted commas because the conflict between WN and British Nationalism was heavily played down, to the detriment of the latter

[Wombaticus Rex]

Could this overall trend be reasonably characterized as "The Balkanization of Whiteness" ?

Because that's going to be an interesting process to witness.

[jakell]

Could this overall trend be reasonably characterized as "The Balkanization of Whiteness" ?

Because that's going to be an interesting process to witness.

It could be, but it's not really a trend and, in the UK at least, White Nationalism is the only game left in town likely to appeal to the more hardline BNP and NF types

Traditional nationalisms have complicated histories and local complexity to deal with, whereas WN is a simple and abstract ideology that rarely has to deal with real world problems, it has more in common with religion than politics. To those who are feeling a sense of real or imagined loss (the bread and butter of right wing causes), there is really no contest, the dream tends to win out in the end.

[semper occultus]

...the old right wing order that needs to be destroyed is British Nationalism as represented by the BNP and NF. This has noticeably already happened though as both those parties are now shadows of their former selves......

.....I have to say though that whilst the demise of the nation-state has been much heralded and indeed actively worked for with some alacrity by all sorts of people at both ends of the spectrum ....none of whom seem overly enamoured of ideas of democractic accountability...

http://rigorousintuition.ca/board2/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=10235&p=579808#p99205

....it seems a pretty tenacious tangle of roots to dig out and any success achieved by "the right" in the current crisis is still very much about appeals to small-state nationalism not some Hitlerian pan-europa....

.....I'm not up with the ideology but the demise of e.g. the BNP is surely directly connected to the consequent ascendancy of UKIP who have been able to position themselves as a more respectable face of populist nationalism...

....Marine le Penn has pulled off a similar trick within the French NF itself ( less convincingly it must be said hence Farage has refused to enter into any agreements with the French NF in the European Parliament )

...by the same token the Eastern European reaction to the refugee situation exhibited almost instinctive recoil from the idea of some common european homeland that the gnomes of the Brussels bureacracy have spent hundreds of billions over the last few decades trying to build up....

[American Dream]

THE WHITE STUFF: AN OPEN LETTER TO THE RIGHT STUFF AND THE DAILY SHOAH

The argument then that we are on the side of the “status quo” is one that is actually true to a degree. We do stand with the vast majority of working class people that see we have much more to gain by coming together in solidarity than we do by dividing ourselves by arbitrary phenotypes. There is nothing that bonds a white person biologically to another white person over a person of color, and to say that there is has been one of the most long-standing misreading of science by those with racial anger and fear as their motivation. While we see that conscious racism is no longer a dominant paradigm, due directly to the long-working anti-racist organizing of the last 200 years, institutional racism is still alive in well. The antifascist movement, however, is only targeting a specific subset of the reactionary white population who is desperately trying to hold onto the illusionary benefits of white privilege. Anytime you see a revolution happening that challenges the hierarchy that the ruling class benefits from, you will see some try to hold onto the meager superiority they have. This is true white white nationalists, as well as Men’s Rights Activists in regards to gender equality, the Religious Right in regards to queer rights, and so on. In a period of social upheaval, there will always be a vanguard of the fascist movement, and as working-class organizers that is one of the greatest enemies of mass social transformation in the direction of democracy and equality. In a funny way, we assume you would agree with this.

At the same time, what is the status quo? For most of American history there has been a mass white on color genocide and enslavement. Millions of Native Americans murdered, black people turned into livestock, and, today, literally locking up an entire generation of African Americans. What is the status quo here? Those working to eliminate the most glaring examples of conscious racism, or those wanting to reinforce the implicit racism that defines American institutions? We are aware that from your standing point you are oppressed by multiculturalism. I’m wondering if a black man being lynched by the Klan would agree that you are oppressed because you might be reprimanded at work for using the n-word. Yeah, you certainly are a victim class.

So what is the threat of fascism? This is actually something we have answered on this website at length. We will direct you to the first two articles in a series that explains why we oppose fascism, which includes the variants you prefer such as New Right, Alt Right, neoreaction, Dark Enlightenment, etc.What is the Real Threat of Fascist Organizing? and Anarchism vs Fascism) The third will be out shortly dealing with the lone-wolf violence that your rhetoric inspires, and we will gladly send it over. These fascist ideas, rooted in traditionalism, racialism, and hierarchy, are the functional opposite of what drives our organizing. You could say that we literally have nothing in common.

http://antifascistnews.net/2015/08/20/t ... aily-shoa/

[Wombaticus Rex]

...literally locking up an entire generation of African Americans.

There is literally no way that could be true.

Edit: an interesting exchange here in the comment section:
http://antifascistnews.net/2015/08/16/c ... ite-hoods/

>>Reaction
I was going to write some detailed account of how I used to be an “anti-fascist” in my early 20s and how your cognitive dissonance and unconditional hatred of white people drove me to the alt-right but you wouldn’t read it.

I’ll just say this. The alt-right is not 60+ year old tea partiers clutching their money. We’re young and we used to be you. By and large we were leftists, some even radical leftists. What made us change? You. We’re a reaction to you. The story is always the same. The unconditional anti-white hatred from you, your professors, and your brown pets drives these white kids away from leftism completely and in many cases to the extreme right. Do with that what you will.

Oh and I love that you’re essentially admitting that you and your ideological brethren are now in power and we’re confined to our basements for fear of having our lives ruined for disagreeing with you. Who’s the fascist now?

>>antifascistfront
You’re quite right. I wouldn’t read it.

>>Reaction
Good. Please keep doing what you’re doing. We wouldn’t exist without you.

[seemslikeadream]

is it ok with you if I start 7 more OP's on domestic terrorism?

or stick to the unofficial rule that EVERYONE ELSE here follows except AD

oh and how many times does one get to publish the rules around here...ain't that against the rules?

everyone here knows the rules we don't need a reminder from AD ....is there a problem I'm not seeing?

[guruilla]

>>Reaction
I was going to write some detailed account of how I used to be an “anti-fascist” in my early 20s and how your cognitive dissonance and unconditional hatred of white people drove me to the alt-right but you wouldn’t read it.

I’ll just say this. The alt-right is not 60+ year old tea partiers clutching their money. We’re young and we used to be you. By and large we were leftists, some even radical leftists. What made us change? You. We’re a reaction to you. The story is always the same. The unconditional anti-white hatred from you, your professors, and your brown pets drives these white kids away from leftism completely and in many cases to the extreme right. Do with that what you will.

Oh and I love that you’re essentially admitting that you and your ideological brethren are now in power and we’re confined to our basements for fear of having our lives ruined for disagreeing with you. Who’s the fascist now?

Cogent and convincing. I have felt that way many times, if I had the capacity to become possessed by a political ideology (ie, sufficiently low self-awareness), it might have happened to me too.

Makes me wonder if that's AD's end goal here too? (Joke. I think?)