Angry White People

[jakell]

Another motivation for me keeping this simple is that I really want to talk about the OP and the NF etc, I'm entertaining all this because you wanted me to put it aside for the time being (like you said, it won't go away). There's no good reason why the subject of race should be smeared thinly across 10 interchangeable threads, it's a pain in the arse.

Yeah fine this is going nowhere.

Tell us what your WN mates think about attacking defenseless coons.

I didn't have any WN mates the last time I checked.

I think in a roundabout way you are referring to the thread topic. I mentioned that NF documentary as a way of giving some more context to the earlier parts of Benjamin Zephaniah's piece.

Yes, I read the article Joe.

If insecurity is a major driver of hate, then people who are 'actually' against that sort of thing would not support color revolutions and other modern contrivances that generate insecurity.

What I mainly took from it was its views on the 70's National Front, I was young at that time and have only really written properly on the BNP from mid-eighties onwards, it's good to understand them as a precursor that had a significantly different MO to Griffin's BNP which was a function of the times and it is my belief that their extremism led to an overreaction on the part of the 'Looney Left' (Brits will recognise this term) starting in the mid Eighties. As we know, overreaction starts the pendulum swinging and one of its results (IMO) is the turning of a blind eye to Rotherham type situations.
The next reaction will very likely be against this political correctness, and I think we are seeing elements of this, even though it is happening outside of the mainstream political sphere.

This is a good documentary on the National Front:



The timing of it is interesting because, even though it mostly describes Tyndall's leadership period (70's-80's), it was made just 6 months before he was ousted by Griffin in 1999. It's easy to see why the party (by then the BNP) made little progress under Tyndall, but Griffin here looks like he would have carried on in the same vein. This didn't happen though and it seems he was canny enough to moderate the party's image, hence their successes in the 00's

And what does that have to do with the OP?

.......So, a lot of us will take different things from Benjamin Zephaniah's piece depending on our own experiences, as a fair bit of what he talks of is personally familiar to me I'm sort of able to start from there and he's certainly drawn my attention back to some pre BNP stuff. Have a watch of that NF documentary if you can and I'd be interested in what was happening in your part of the world in that respect. This really speaks to what I have been saying about appreciating those 'different nationalisms' and how it is a tactical error to assume that there is this homogeneous white nationalism all over the world.

[Joe Hillshoist]

I think in a roundabout way you are referring to the thread topic. I mentioned that NF documentary as a way of giving some more context to the earlier parts of Benjamin Zephaniah's piece.

What context does it provide?

And more obviously

Why would I want to see a documentary on the national front in the 70s?

[jakell]

I think in a roundabout way you are referring to the thread topic. I mentioned that NF documentary as a way of giving some more context to the earlier parts of Benjamin Zephaniah's piece.

What context does it provide?

And more obviously

Why would I want to see a documentary on the national front in the 70s?

The early part of BZ's piece talks of the NF and his experiences in the seventies, more detail tends to provide context, and you did seem to express an interest in the OP (at least you mentioned it to Sounder) . If one is familiar with neither then cross-referencing is useful if one wants to study these things.

I usually post as if someone out there is interested, and if they're not, they're not. Personally I'm developing a bit more of an interest in Tyndall as he was mostly before my time.

I've posted a fair bit here on the sometimes uneasy relationship between British Nationalism and White Nationalism, WN being a mostly foreign import (or rather, the cognisance of this it is a useful tool to undermine the far right). Tyndall seems to be the figure that held together that mixture for so long, when Griffin came along the cracks became more visible.
Other, younger parts of the anglosphere (Australia, US, Canada) will only really have WN as a backdrop to far-right activity, so will have a noticably different trajectory, and I'm wondering how this has played out. As I've said, I reckon the belief in a homogenous WN culture around the world is a handicap to antifascism, and local detail is important, which is why I asked you about your part of the world,

[American Dream]

There seems to me little doubt that jakell would qualify well for the label of "a loser amongst losers"- and he has long shown what borders on an obsession with this particular chapter of British racist history and seems emotionally close to the drama of it all. His distancing himself from the bricks being thrown at children in this way seems highly questionable.

[jakell]

There seems to me little doubt that jakell would qualify well for the label of "a loser amongst losers"- and he has long shown what borders on an obsession with this particular chapter of British racist history and seems emotionally close to the drama of it all. His distancing himself from the bricks being thrown at children in this way seems highly questionable.

Not really, up till now I've shown more interest in the period where BZ leaves off in his piece, this has been a re-introduction to it inspired by your OP (something you have yet to address at all).

The fact that his 'history' dovetails with mine is interesting though, and I'll be getting around to that later.

[Searcher08]

There seems to me little doubt that jakell would qualify well for the label of "a loser amongst losers"- and he has long shown what borders on an obsession with this particular chapter of British racist history and seems emotionally close to the drama of it all. His distancing himself from the bricks being thrown at children in this way seems highly questionable.

Passive aggression with the zingy flavour of Othering is something to behold.

Given that you have chosen to post a metric fuckton of screeds FROM that particular period of life in the UK and seem to regard yourself as being a bit of an authority on it, when in fact your actual experience of it appears to be zero, I think that point is moot. The thing that appear not to be able to abide is actually being rigorously challenged on your CopyPasta err.. content.

As someone who, unlike yourself, was actually there and marched against the NF in Manchester while in the late 70s, your experience-free remarks reminded me of when you described your ACTUAL experiences of sharp-end fighting encounters with antisemitism you had had in your life.
Which, to summarize, was didly squat.

Personally, I have an aversion to your interpretive rather than experiential engagement with life, where one's entire worldview is filtered through a fear-based metasystem built on arrogance, entitlement and being holier-than-thou with people who do not share your viewpoint, but that is your bag. You support and propagate the SS (George "Antifafa" Soros and Spencer "Re-education Camp" Sunshine) and for that, should be called respectfully and robustly called out, especially around your boths sides are as bad as each other then post only anti-Russian screeds lol .

It also reminded me of you (and the now banned vitriol-Tweeting hasbara-ranting EQ-missing troll-robot Solace) dissing factual arguing with Holocaust deniers and you getting extremely butthurt over the fact that the best thread on actually WINNING against those dicks was posted by jakell, and that your own contributions on the subject were consistently been Othering, pompous, SJW parody - designed to inflate Self-Righteous Egos in mutual windbaggery, rather than, you know, actually engage and change hearts and minds.

[jakell]

If you marched against the NF in the late seventies Searcher, then it seems you predate me by quite a bit, I only really started being aware of the far right and opposition to it in the early eighties, by which time their election hopes were well behind them. In the documentary above, Tyndall is remarkably blase about it though.
I sometimes wonder what the situation would have been if we had a Griffin-style BNP (or even a UKIP) instead of the NF in the seventies. They really contained the seeds of their own destruction, and thank God they went. Their style was a gift to their opposition.

I think you are too kind about my anti-WN posts (it wasn't my thread BTW), what I said was only of use in a limited environment. Pitted against the other 'antifascist' material here though, it probably looked good.
You're right about AD's fascination with the British far-right and that period, in fact, I suspect that folks around the world look too much to our own antifascists for inspiration where they really should be looking more at their local situation (and history) if they want to be effective.

[American Dream]

[zangtang]

http://homegrown.co.in/wp-content/uploa ... 5/Vsee.png

[Searcher08]

I am also hearing the sound of Angry Indigo People, and Indigo privilege.

[kool maudit]

Jeff Wells used to publish interesting thoughts about phenomena like aliens, Bigfoot, and pareidolia. It's strange to see these things sort of employed as a ridiculous example of bad European beliefs ("all these stupid things and yet not PRIVILEGE") here, like it's the remnant-forum of some sort of antifa Buzzfeed.

[Luther Blissett]

The opinion has typically gotten a pass in polite society in the past, but amongst younger people today, race-based sexual attraction and exclusion is seen as racist. Or, to clarify, the statement, "I'm not attracted to [xyz race]" is rightfully considered racist more broadly now.

Maybe it always was, but I think that this statement is probably the most common racist statement I've heard throughout my life.

[tapitsbo]

Would the remedy for this selective attraction be something like "curing gays" through whatever form of behaviourist conditioning?

The ONLY form of such exclusion that is socially acceptable around where I live is not being attracted to whites - whites often say this as a way to come across as virtuous.

I think polite society means something different where you live Luther.

[NeonLX]

White people spinning their whitewall tires.

[Searcher08]

(Totally) Anecdotal Observations:

I've come across plenty of liberals who were Democrat, equal rights, affirmative action folks but for whom interracial couples were a total no-no. Consistently, when I asked asked why they were so put out, they replied with a cliche like "Salt and Pepper don't mix".

In the UK whites dating (East) Indians and Far East folks seems very commonplace, but much less so with Pakistani (Muslim) and whites. White women and black guys - common. White guys and black women - very uncommon.

There are lots of white women on dating sites who specify black (West Indian) only partners - and these women often comment on getting shit from people. There are some women who specify white-only but they are very rare in comparison and guesstimate divided equally between black and white women..

I have never seen a white man expressing in their profile any form of racial preference on POF or OKC or Match.

My own experiences in London were that dating a Japanese woman caused no comment. However, dating a West African woman was like entering BizzarroWorld. The public collection of evil looks, barely sub-breath mutterings and outright hostility (from both blacks and whites to both me and her) was barf-inducing.