The Little Führer

[Luther Blissett]

I'm actually pretty sure that Jakell knows better than that. If he really is an anarchist I'm sure he understands institutional global power and threats.

[tapitsbo]

I'm not sure what you are referring to exactly (since when do anarchists understand anything?) but I'm pretty sure you're not getting at anything real or meaningful.

We were talking about voices calling for genocidal violence, right? I still can't suss out your criteria for when that's important or not. So where are you going with this, again?

[jakell]

Antifa types want sooooo much for the simpler archetypes of mid 20th century Europe to emerge that they have to really push this set of half-baked musings into a full length article (and of course, a picture from Nazi Germany was needed here).


Of course if they want confrontation, even organised confrontation, that is not hard to come by, but there's no need to invent such a framework for it in advance (unless it's for the inevitable 'we told you so').

You don't think it's important to keep tabs on this development? , I think it is. We have what, like 30-40 good anecdotal narratives about scenes from Trump rallies which weave a broad-based story of racist and xenophobic rhetoric that's now reversing course after a multi-decades long stint of progress? Combined with one of the exact precursive factors in genocidal regimes throughout the 20th century?

They're looking in the right direction, but as usual it's overblown and florid. All the stuff about Hitler and Mussolini etc is just padding and distracting narrative. A shorter, factual and up to date piece would be more use tactically.

[tapitsbo]

Hold up, jakell; I think Luther's comment about institutional global power IS useful. It points to how we need to take into account the way discourse about race maps globally in order to understand it in context.

[jakell]

Hold up, jakell; I think Luther's comment about institutional global power IS useful. It points to how we need to take into account the way discourse about race maps globally in order to understand it in context.

These are two ends of the scale; practical anti-fascism in a present context, and a large global handwaving exercise.

Of course the latter is interesting, but antifascistnews purports to aim at tackling present realites (like most antifa 'realists'), however they often get carried away. The fact that we are already talking about something fairly abstract sort of proves my point, Trump and present realities start to get put aside.

[Luther Blissett]

On the contrary, it seems to me that present realities have the utmost attention of norms and regs. I can only find couple places to discuss the more abstract historically contextual theoretical ideas about proto-fascism.

[tapitsbo]

Can you recommend any authors Luther? Georges Sorel is pretty entertaining, I need to get back to reading Mao though.

[jakell]

Hold up, jakell; I think Luther's comment about institutional global power IS useful. It points to how we need to take into account the way discourse about race maps globally in order to understand it in context.

These are two ends of the scale; practical anti-fascism in a present context, and a large global handwaving exercise.

Of course the latter is interesting, but antifascistnews purports to aim at tackling present realites (like most antifa 'realists'), however they often get carried away. The fact that we are already talking about something fairly abstract sort of proves my point, Trump and present realities start to get put aside.

On the contrary, it seems to me that present realities have the utmost attention of norms and regs. I can only find couple places to discuss the more abstract historically contextual theoretical ideas about proto-fascism.

I am assuming that antifascistnews is trying to produce practical antifascism in the present day and specifically relating to the Trump issues discussed, not encourage a round of navel gazing. I'm also relating this to several other critiques of their output that I've done here.

Really, I'm trying to get folks to discuss these issues (by, shock-horror, offering opinions) rather than the usual disinterest. AD's posts usually receive no replies, no critique, no discussion and possibly even no attention.
If this is indeed an antifascist forum (and the jury is still out as far as I'm concerned), then this lack of interest is hard to explain.

[tapitsbo]

I think to help us understand the arbitrary focus of the anti-fascists we need to get a better handle on master signifiers like "racism" and how they function in the context of global institutional power.

Is antifascism an autoimmune response against crackers in the West assimilating to attitudes typical in the rest of the world?

Maybe autoimmunity isn't the right term if it is being directed from outside to some extent...

The pattern of parallel deployment of ethnonationalists and antifa in regards to Ukraine and now more broadly certainly is reminiscent of tried and true methods of colonialism...

[jakell]

Antifascistnews - "Taking on Fascism and Racism from the Ground Up."

In going against the grain and actually daring to offer a response to one of AD's pastes, I thought it best to find some perspective, and used the above (as I've done before). Notice that this thread is also about fairly down to Earth stuff too, that's if people still believe in threads any more and not 50 differently similar poorly attended scrapbooks where anything goes

[jakell]

I will admit to be a bit over-critical of antifa types, but I'm simply taking a stance that is in juxtaposition to their inner beliefs of being on the side of light in some Heaven n' Hell type conflict'**. This is reflected by people who repost their stuff without a second glance (and those who barely skim it, nodding appreciatively ).

Antifascistnews has been up here a few times by now and has made enough unexamined questionable statements to earn a slight roasting IMO. Who knows, they may even take what I've said on board and tighten their act up a bit.

** In a fairly recent Radix podcast (which I was directed to by 'antifascistnews') Richard Spencer uses the term 'social justice warriors', which I find pretty amusing.

[tapitsbo]

I am not sure if I find it amusing. Someone fighting a genuine social justice fight like trying to find out what happened to people murdered while incarcerated in prisons or psych wards (to name one of a million possible examples) now has to deal with being smeared by association with vapid abusive assholes who are themselves just acting out petty establishment approved agendas to foment violence.

I highly suspect that the likes of Richard Spencer AND the flimsy antifa writers are all intelligence assets and that the humourless SJW moniker (check out the people who identify by this label let's see how they charm you) was encouraged by TPTB along with the tone deaf substancessless audience cults of the left that have been cultivated on places like tumblr and and in educational institutions.

[American Dream]

Islamophobia is part of big ecology that includes not only Trumpville but- as Heimbach and his fellow travelers know so well- some even more openly fascist and racist characters:

Soldiers of Odin: Canadians United 4 Canada Ally With Overt Neo-Nazis

Much more at: http://anti-racistcanada.blogspot.com/2 ... ted-4.html

[tapitsbo]

I thought it was promising that Joe Hillshoist, obviously very sympathetic to Muslims in the West, was willing to consider the possibility that criticism of islamic institutions in the west should not be censored in some contexts. Unfortunately a wildly more repressive attitude is much more prevalent and therefore there is little dialogue (except for from "neocon" types who are fundamentally hostile to both western and islamic civilization). The privileges granted by the Trudeau government to individuals and organizations associated with terrorism seem designed to my eyes to prime the pump of future resentment, not that I have any nostalgia whatsoever for the execrable Harper government.

The use of an affective tag like "phobia" is typical of AD at this late hour when many have moved onto a more fruitful and collaborative sort of discussion. It impresses me that others here are able to have a more interesting conversation. I sense the."phobia" term is becoming deeply offensive since it presumes that a broad set of political issues as well as an entire religion are beyond discussion or criticism. I don't think it would be unfair to characterize such an attitude as "totalitarian", a term which is beloved of duplicitous Western liberals but still retains more semantic valence than "fascist".

[jakell]

Islamophobia is part of big ecology that includes not only Trumpville but- as Heimbach and his fellow travelers know so well- some even more openly fascist and racist characters:
Much more at: http://anti-racistcanada.blogspot.com/2 ... ted-4.html

Where on Earth have you pulled the concept of Islamaphobia for in this instance? It isn't present in the recent discussion here, and neither is it present in the article you link to.

Your thoughts seem to be almost completely random and don't link up.