‘Human sacrifice’ staged at CERN's Shiva Statue

[MacCruiskeen]

If this CERN thing is a hazing ritual, I'm curious who the hazees were. Was it the girl in the middle? Or was it the boys in the sheets?

I'd guess the girl and the kneeling people were first-years, and the guys doing the theatrical business were second-years.

CERN is not a university. There are no "first-years" or "second-years" in a Summer Student Programme.

the boys in the sheets

That is so typical of you. So very New RI.

[MacCruiskeen]

By the way, this is from CERN's FAQ:

On average, how many students apply for the Summer Students Programme and how many are selected?

Every year about 1000 candidates apply for this programme, and of these only 140 are selected.

https://jobs.web.cern.ch/faq/general-information

So, about one in seven applicants are selected, and probably only seriously studious high-fliers even bother to apply in the first place. I.e., even the Summer School is a pretty crème de la crème affair. It's a privilege and an accolade to be accepted there, a big feather in any young student's cap and a great thing to have on their CV. It's not the kind of thing you'd expect any of them to sacrifice lightly -- least of all ten of them at once. (And why would they? "For lulz"? Really?)

[PufPuf93]

By the way, this is from CERN's FAQ:

On average, how many students apply for the Summer Students Programme and how many are selected?

Every year about 1000 candidates apply for this programme, and of these only 140 are selected.

https://jobs.web.cern.ch/faq/general-information

So, about one in seven applicants are selected, and probably only seriously studious high-fliers even bother to apply in the first place. I.e., even the Summer School is a pretty crème de la crème affair. It's a privilege and an accolade to be accepted there, a big feather in any young student's cap and a great thing to have on their CV. It's not the kind of thing you'd expect any of them to sacrifice lightly -- least of all ten of them at once.

There are various fraternities at the world's great universities - Greek system, academic, elitist (such s Skull and Bones) - that have secretive and sometimes weird initiation rituals; many such fraternities are every bit or more exclusive than CERN.

Not assigning any value judgement, but those participating in the fraternities follow the traditions de rigueur. Not participating once selected or joining and breaking the secrecy oath would be acts that sacrificed their potential future.

[MacCruiskeen]

Again: CERN is not a university.

Also, it is not ancient.

[PufPuf93]

Again: CERN is not a university.

As stated above, CERN is an institution with students.

Fraternities are not limited to universities. There are professional and social and secret societies so on as well; what they hold in common are initiation of some sort and secrecy. Some are relatively wholesome, some are not.

Parse as you will.

[PufPuf93]

Again: CERN is not a university.

Also, it is not ancient.

What is the relevance of ancient except that ritual and form may resemble and borrow from the past?

Every fraternity started at some point in time.

[MacCruiskeen]

So let me get this straight: You're saying this hypothetical "elite secret society" of yours just upped and performed its "secret initiation/hazing ritual/bonding-rite" in a well-lit, wide-open public space, in full view of the many surveillance cameras on the CERN site, and in full view of any (presumably non-initiated and non-elite) security guards (and additional security patrols) who happened to pass by?





Some "secrecy" that is. They might as well have done it at Piccadilly Circus.

[MacCruiskeen]

A miracle! An article about this deeply strange incident that doesn't just parrot every other piece of dutiful stenography in the corporate media, but actually raises some interesting points and insists on keeping on asking the obvious questions (none of which have yet been adequately or plausibly answered).

It's by a guy called Tom Siebert at San Diego City Beat. The whole thing's well worth reading, but I'll just post the part dealing with the CERN incident:

All Things Tech
Aug. 22 2016 04:42 PM
There will be blood
Sorting through the hype, spin and lies of future tech

By Tom Siebert editor@sdcitybeat.com


[...]

There have been all kinds of maybe crazy conspiracy conversations about what CERN's really doing—Time travel? Black-hole creation? A Star Trek-like transporter?—but nothing you could hang onto without being dismissed as a nutter until last week, when somebody posted a YouTube video of a Satanic ritual mock human sacrifice, complete with black robes and stabbed female victim dressed in white, on the central outdoor grounds at CERN, right in front of its huge statue of the Hindu god Shiva the Destroyer.

The video was quickly removed from YouTube, but people mirrored the video and the British tabloids started writing about it (though the American press has been dutifully silent, even though it would surely drive page views), so YouTube began permitting people to post it again.

The video caused such a stir that a spokesperson (never named in any account I've been able to find) has been forced to confirm the event actually did take place and was filmed on the CERN campus, but was done as a joke by scientists and researchers at the facility without official knowledge or permission. It was just a group of super-intelligent people "taking their sense of humour too far," CERN stated.

So taking the "joke" at face value and accepting CERN's story, I still think it's fair to ask...What the fuck? Why are scientists replicating a human sacrifice on the grounds of one of science's most controversial and mysterious ongoing projects, in front of the Hindu god of destruction to boot? Who filmed this? Who are the participants? Who was the "victim?" What does this say about security at such a revolutionary scientific site?

Even if the most benign explanation of what happened at CERN is accepted, it still raises a slew of unsettling questions that deserve answering. Let's see who, if anybody, chases them down.

http://sdcitybeat.com/article-17728-the ... blood.html

[PufPuf93]

So let me get this straight: You're saying this hypothetical "elite secret society" of yours just upped and performed its "secret initiation/hazing ritual/bonding-rite" in a well-lit, wide-open public space, in full view of the many surveillance cameras on the CERN site, and in full view of any (presumably non-initiated and non-elite) security guards (and additional security patrols) who happened to pass by?

Some "secrecy" that is. They might as well have done it at Piccadilly Circus.

Specifically, I was responding directly to the immediately preceding post in this exchange.

I have no firm idea as to what occurred except that a video was made and posted to the internet.

Because of CERN security - a controlled space, video cameras, people present 24/7 - you are likely correct that someone(s), whether security or other, knows more than us internet consumers and discussers.

Ritual associated with a fraternity or similar group is one of the possibilities discussed here at RI.

Piccadilly Circus is not closed to the public like CERN, it is essentially an open street scene.

You should try holding yourself to the same exactness you expect of others.

I respond to posts and sometimes try to add some substance or background, sometimes idiosyncratic to my own experiences (as evidenced in this thread).

[Novem5er]

the boys in the sheets

That is so typical of you. So very New RI.

I'm comfortable with figurative language. Why aren't you?

That said, I think Mac is right in this case: it'd be weird for a secret society to conduct an embarrassing ritual right out in the open. It's the exact same reason that most of us don't believe this was a real occult murder.

With the number of visitors and residents in the area, open viewing, the bright lights and long shadows, and the security cameras, it's almost as if they wanted to be seen. Of course, there's the convenient positioning of the cameraman who was recording the spot before the cloaked figures even arrived. All of this points to internet trolling . . . which, after all, has the end goal of being seeing by as many people as possible. Yes, I acknowledge that real occultists and real murderer MIGHT want to make their ceremony go viral for some nefarious purpose; I just think it's less likely.

As to why a bunch of privileged youth would risk everything for a prank? I'd say college-aged kids are exactly the kind of people who engage in high-risk behavior; and often the more privileged the youth, the longer that behavior continues. Look at Ryan Lochte at this recent Olympics.

(snip)
That's a great piece of sociology btw, well worth a read.

There might be some of that in this, but I see more of another aspect that's common in initiations - the death/rebirth thing. There's a before and an after, you die to your old self and emerge from the ritual as someone new. It's in baptisms, the Hadj, the Freemasons' third degree - and all those cults took it from somewhere older.

Yes, good stuff; thanks for sharing. I believe Skull & Bones has a fake funeral for their pledges, and I'm sure they do plenty of homoerotic embarrassing things as well. I'm willing to bet that a lot of frats have dual rituals: some meant to break down a pledge and unite them with embarrassment (and blackmail), and then another ritual to build them back up and welcome them (reborn) as a new person and full brother. But as said earlier, if this CERN thing is a frat ritual, it's one that must be an open secret on campus (or something brand new and not well thought-out).

[PufPuf93]

"So taking the "joke" at face value and accepting CERN's story, I still think it's fair to ask...What the fuck? Why are scientists replicating a human sacrifice on the grounds of one of science's most controversial and mysterious ongoing projects, in front of the Hindu god of destruction to boot? Who filmed this? Who are the participants? Who was the "victim?" What does this say about security at such a revolutionary scientific site?"

Is this not the very thing we are doing here at RI?

The only items from the media or internet regards this event I have reviewed are what is in this thread.

[MacCruiskeen]

Ritual associated with a fraternity or similar group is one of the possibilities discussed here at RI.

I know it is. That's where I read it: here at RI. That's why I'm responding to it here at RI. That's why I'm taking the trouble to post photos and information that actually demonstrate clearly that secrecy and exclusive in-group privacy were anything but priorities for the ten-or-more participants in this leisurely-paced, high-visibility, al fresco "ritual".

Behind the scenes of GS: security affects us all

A CERN manager, supported by two outside companies, manages the three entities in the GS Department that are in charge of various aspects of security. In total, about 80 people, 300 cameras, a surveillance centre (CSA) and 22 kilometres of fences are responsible for ensuring that the Organization is secure.

https://cds.cern.ch/journal/CERNBulleti ... 4688?ln=en

[PufPuf93]

That's why I'm taking the trouble to post photos and information that actually demonstrate clearly that secrecy and exclusive in-group privacy were anything but priorities for the ten-or-more participants in this leisurely-paced, high-visibility, al fresco "ritual".

Behind the scenes of GS: security affects us all

A CERN manager, supported by two outside companies, manages the three entities in the GS Department that are in charge of various aspects of security. In total, about 80 people, 300 cameras, a surveillance centre (CSA) and 22 kilometres of fences are responsible for ensuring that the Organization is secure.

https://cds.cern.ch/journal/CERNBulleti ... 4688?ln=en

I agree with you in general and thank you for the information in your posts.

The ritual did occur in a location with secure and limited access during "off hours" not "in public"

I would wager that managers at CERN - because of the security system - likely have identified the identified many if not all of the participants who have been questioned as to why the ritual occurred.

I can speculate in more than one avenue why CERN would not elaborate to the public. I don't ever expect to get a clear public explanation from CERN. Even if CERN was to relate to the public a true bill, there are many folks so inclined to never believe CERN authorities in any case.

I can also speculate why some folks think the mystery and lore of a death ritual to Shiva at CERN being on the internet is just dandy. Some of these folks may not be that wholesome, some may just be silly.

[MacCruiskeen]

I can speculate in more than one avenue why CERN would not elaborate to the public. I don't ever expect to get a clear public explanation from CERN.

Well, PufPuf, unlike me you're clearly not a citizen of (or a taxpayer in) any of the 22 nation-states whose taxes wholly support this Mysterious Gigantic Financial Black Hole, to the tune of well over a billion [1,000,000,000] dollars every year. (And this in The Age of Austerity.)

As an American you may well be more inured to (and more resigned to) post-democratic non-accountability than I am, and than most other Europeans are. CERN have said they have instituted an inquiry. Finding out what happened is not rocket-science and cannot possibly take very long, and the results of that inquiry should be public knowledge asap. The people who pay for this Money Hole have a right to know what that grotesque murder-show was all about, and pretty damn soon too.

The one-paragraph "explanation" they posted on their website last week -- only under pressure and only after the damn video had become unignorable -- is just insultingly perfunctory and insultingly poor. Really: How dare they?

[PufPuf93]

I can speculate in more than one avenue why CERN would not elaborate to the public. I don't ever expect to get a clear public explanation from CERN.

Well, PufPuf, unlike me you're clearly not a citizen of (or a taxpayer in) any of the 22 nation-states whose taxes wholly support this Mysterious Gigantic Financial Black Hole, to the tune of well over a billion [1,000,000,000] dollars every year. (And this in The Age of Austerity.)

As an American you may well be more inured to (and more resigned to) post-democratic non-accountability than I am, and than most other Europeans are. CERN have said they have instituted an inquiry. Finding out what happened is not rocket-science and cannot possibly take very long, and the results of that inquiry should be public knowledge asap. The people who pay for this Money Hole have a right to know what that grotesque murder-show was all about, and pretty damn soon too.

I agree with you.

I am 100% for accountability of public supported institutions.

I am greatly disturbed by the long term happenstance as to what is the USA.

I have mentioned here at RI that I am a sometimes enthusiastic multiple alumnus of Cal (UC Berkeley) and was a federal employee from 1969 to 1985.

By no mean does that mean I support every program, piece of research, priority, what I was taught, nor alumni of that university nor just about anything then or now from the federal government.

That said, my Dad went to 8th grade and did things like crush gravel, build roads, and log - he ran heavy equipment - and the worst thing I could do in his eyes was to work for the federal government (think me Malheur wildlife manager, Dad Bundy militia) and go to "that hippy school" (on my own dime, scholarships, and concurrent federal job). Both experiences widened my scope incredibly and provided many opportunities. Cal especially has much to do with who I am and the type of people I like even though attendance was decades ago. I by choice have never opted to join any sort of fraternal organization (or faith-based institution).

I agree that the USA is post-democratic / post-accountability and disturbed to where I have for all intents and purposes dis-engaged. It helps being old in this regard.

I agree that CERN should provide a true explanation (but CERN probably will not).

I agree that CERN has a responsibility for public accountability.

I have stated that CERN likely knows who and what happened.