Who Was Seth Rich?

[Blue]

So ... ??????


In an audio recording provided to Big League Politics by a source that currently wishes to remain anonymous, journalist Seymour Hersh confirms that Seth Rich had contacted WikiLeaks with sample emails from the leak. Hersh cites an FBI document as proof for his claim.

“There are no DNC or Podesta emails that exist beyond May 21 or 22, last email from either one of those groups. What the report says is that some time in late Spring… he makes contact with WikiLeaks, that’s in his computer,” he says. “Anyway, they found what he had done is that he had submitted a series of documents — of emails, of juicy emails, from the DNC.”

Hersh explains that it was unclear how the negotiations went, but that WikiLeaks did obtain access to a password protected DropBox where Rich had put the files.

“All I know is that he offered a sample, an extensive sample, I’m sure dozens of emails, and said ‘I want money.’ Later, WikiLeaks did get the password, he had a DropBox, a protected DropBox,” he said. They got access to the DropBox.”

Hersh also states that Rich had concerns about something happening to him, and had

“The word was passed, according to the NSA report, he also shared this DropBox with a couple of friends, so that ‘if anything happens to me it’s not going to solve your problems,’” he added. “WikiLeaks got access before he was killed.”

How does Hersh have access to FBI documents? Has he posted that doc somewhere?

From what I have read about Seth, that doesn't sound like him to say "I want money." After all, he had recently accepted a new job with Hillary's campaign and was moving up in his political career. In fact he was on the phone for hours with his girlfriend and family right before he was murdered discussing his upcoming move to NYC and how that would affect their relationships. Not exactly someone on the verge of making a huge expose, ready to take the money and run.

Why have none of his friends come forward with the DropBox info? Where did Hersh get that info? Does the NSA regularly talk to Hersh?

[elfismiles]

All good questions ... all we know is that Hersh (if that's even really him in the recording) alleges to have contacts in the FBI/NSA who will leak him info.

Agreed, wanting money doesn't sound like what little we know about Seth but ... wtf do we really "KNOW" about any of this?

How does Hersh have access to FBI documents? Has he posted that doc somewhere?

From what I have read about Seth, that doesn't sound like him to say "I want money." After all, he had recently accepted a new job with Hillary's campaign and was moving up in his political career. In fact he was on the phone for hours with his girlfriend and family right before he was murdered discussing his upcoming move to NYC and how that would affect their relationships. Not exactly someone on the verge of making a huge expose, ready to take the money and run.

Why have none of his friends come forward with the DropBox info? Where did Hersh get that info? Does the NSA regularly talk to Hersh?

[liminalOyster]

All good questions ... all we know is that Hersh (if that's even really him in the recording) alleges to have contacts in the FBI/NSA who will leak him info.

Agreed, wanting money doesn't sound like what little we know about Seth but ... wtf do we really "KNOW" about any of this?

How does Hersh have access to FBI documents? Has he posted that doc somewhere?

From what I have read about Seth, that doesn't sound like him to say "I want money." After all, he had recently accepted a new job with Hillary's campaign and was moving up in his political career. In fact he was on the phone for hours with his girlfriend and family right before he was murdered discussing his upcoming move to NYC and how that would affect their relationships. Not exactly someone on the verge of making a huge expose, ready to take the money and run.

Why have none of his friends come forward with the DropBox info? Where did Hersh get that info? Does the NSA regularly talk to Hersh?

I'm a little concerned about the idea of "what we know of Seth" given that his parents, IIRC, seem to have been so vested in preserving his image based on their own predilection that leaking/whistleblowing is dishonorable.

[Cordelia]

elfismiles:

Agreed, wanting money doesn't sound like what little we know about Seth but ... wtf do we really "KNOW" about any of this?

liminalOyster:

I'm a little concerned about the idea of "what we know of Seth" given that his parents, IIRC, seem to have been so vested in preserving his image based on their own predilection that leaking/whistleblowing is dishonorable.

Exactly; my thoughts too. What does anyone, outside of those directly involved (maybe), really know about why Seth Rich was killed?

Edited to add, w/all due respect to the Rich family, family members can be the ones with the most invested (emotion) in, but with the least 'real' knowledge about, a loved one.

"There are always two parties to a death; the person who dies and the survivors who are bereaved." Arnold Toynbee

Especially in the aftermath of a murder.

Also, if there is a cover-up, family and others close to the victim; those who care most that the killer(s) are found, have to be handled. That's just commonsensical.

[Jerky]

Just by way of quick drive-by explanation, Hersh says that the recording in question takes him entirely out of context, and that he was describing the current state of the conspiracy theory / gossip, as it stands, and NOT describing reality as he saw it. I believe his exact words re: how this recording is being used were something to the effect of "They add 2 and 2 and get 47".

J

[Jerky]

From http://www.npr.org/2017/08/01/540783715 ... news-story

And Butowsky lays out a different mission than aiding the Rich family. Butowsky says he became convinced that the FBI had a report concluding that Seth Rich's laptop showed he had had contacts with WikiLeaks after speaking to the legendary reporter Seymour Hersh, who was also investigating Rich's death. According to the transcripts in the lawsuit, Butowsky says Hersh had an FBI source who confirmed the report.

In an interview this week, Hersh sounds unconvinced.

"I hear gossip," Hersh tells NPR on Monday. "[Butowsky] took two and two and made 45 out of it."

[liminalOyster]

Just by way of quick drive-by explanation, Hersh says that the recording in question takes him entirely out of context, and that he was describing the current state of the conspiracy theory / gossip, as it stands, and NOT describing reality as he saw it. I believe his exact words re: how this recording is being used were something to the effect of "They add 2 and 2 and get 47".

J

I saw that quote about Butowsky but is Hersh referring specifically to this recording?

[Elvis]

Elvis, can we look at this another way - beyond the known facts that Rich worked for the DNC and was killed in a still-unsolved murder, what actual evidence is there that he WAS the leaker?

(Beyond the speculation and implications of the politically motivated)

Thanks mgf, that's a good question and I want to give it a good answer, but I'm short on time today, thanks for patience.

[Elvis]

Meanwhile let's agree on what we mean by 'evidence':

the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.

[mentalgongfu2]

That seems like a fair general definition. I would only add that the individual facts that make up the body should be judged each on their own merits. I look forward to you having time to reply.

[elfismiles]

So which is it.... ?

"2 and 2 and get 47" or "two and two and made 45 out of it" ????

These issues matter.

And Butowsky lays out a different mission than aiding the Rich family. Butowsky says he became convinced that the FBI had a report concluding that Seth Rich's laptop showed he had had contacts with WikiLeaks after speaking to the legendary reporter Seymour Hersh, who was also investigating Rich's death. According to the transcripts in the lawsuit, Butowsky says Hersh had an FBI source who confirmed the report.

In an interview this week, Hersh sounds unconvinced.

"I hear gossip," Hersh tells NPR on Monday.

To me ... that sounds like Hersh backpeddling / covering his ass as a journalist. It's damn easy for him to walk-back what he breathlessly said in that audio "I have contacts in high places - they share things with me" and diminish them when confronted by MSM reporters as "rumors" and "gossip" which really still paints him as a rumor monger and gossip himself ... assuming that is really him on that tape.

Has anyone seen or heard any specific references to him confirming or denying that tape? it sure as hell SOUNDS like him.

[liminalOyster]

That seems like a fair general definition. I would only add that the individual facts that make up the body should be judged each on their own merits. I look forward to you having time to reply.

I don't mean to be a weasel and I realize the situations are different, but I would point out that there's not much strict evidence that Hastings was murdered and would still assume many if not most here lean (or slouch) towards that conclusion.

edit/ps - despite remaining agnostic about which if any political body would have killed Rich, it's at least worth noting that Hastings last story was on Dems and the NSA

[mentalgongfu2]

Liminal, we're talking here about the death of Seth Rich, a case universally believed to be a murder as I understand it, with the mystery being who did it and why.

I would say bringing in an unrelated case and then broad-brushing RI members comes of as pretty weaselly. Honestly, I am wondering what your point is in bringing it up. There is a Michael Hastings thread somewhere on the forum already. Let's please keep our assumptions on that case to that thread.

[liminalOyster]

Well I don't mean to broadbrush anyone and would include myself in that group so I don't personally think it's a wrong suspicion or conclusion. But it is one necessary drawn largely on a felt sense, no? I mention it here only because it seems the same standard of evidence would or should apply. I don't know about Seth Rich and I definitely agree that there is much less even circumstantial evidence that Rich was "the" DNC leaker much less was murdered as a result.

Given that Rich was shot and apparently died of those injuries it seems fair to say he was murdered but it's worth at least considering that he lived several hours after the assault. IOW I have no reason to disbelieve that but at the same time, most of that evidence is brought to us by bodies whose integrity has been called into question elsewhere on this thread.

[Cordelia]

Listening to the beginning of the Hersh audio, it sounds choppy, maybe doctored. “He’s living in a very rough neighborhood” Bloomingdale? Pre–gentrification maybe, but not now, compared to other areas in D.C. and compared, probably, to wherever Hersh lives,

In the month following Rich’s murder, WaPo published this (obviously to reassure customers of their commercial ‘partnerships’):

Here’s why Bloomingdale is everyone’s favorite neighborhood

By Megan Downey August 12, 2016

https://www.washingtonpost.com/express/ ... cd532cdff5

I think Caitlin Johnstone makes good points in below link:

Aug 3
Seymour Hersh Owes The World An Explanation For His Seth Rich Comments

https://medium.com/@caityjohnstone/seym ... b2756123d3