The Rise of Bigot America Thread

[Morty]

They had a legal right to have their gathering. The ACLU even went to court to secure them that right. As you noted earlier some are saying the cops seem to have left the gathering unprotected from the counterprotesters, and visa versa. Chaos ensued. Did the mayor advise the cops to back away? (Was it within his powers to advise them so? Serious question). The mayor who said:

I have seen tonight the images of torches on the Grounds of the University of Virginia. When I think of torches, I want to think of the Statue of Liberty. When I think of candelight, I want to think of prayer vigils. Today, in 2017, we are instead seeing a cowardly parade of hatred, bigotry, racism, and intolerance march down the lawns of the architect of our Bill of Rights. Everyone has a right under the First Amendment to express their opinion peaceably, so here's mine: not only as the Mayor of Charlottesville, but as a UVA faculty member and alumnus, I am beyond disgusted by this unsanctioned and despicable display of visual intimidation on a college campus.

If you can't see anything inflammatory in what he said, anything which might have contributed to the violence that occurred the next day, I can't be of any help to you. Your other comments are further evidence that your reading comprehension abilities leave a lot to be desired. I dare say I won't be wasting any more time responding to your posts.

[mentalgongfu2]

Liminal - among the "alt right" protesters were people wearing swastika armbands and giving seig heil salutes. I think calling them nazis is pretty damn fair.

Morty - if you see inflammatory rhetoric in a statement that acknowledges the right of the nazis and nazi wannabes to hold their rally peaceably but also calls the behavior, accurately imo, a "cowardly parade of hatred, bigotry, racism, and intolerance march down the lawns of the architect of our Bill of Rights," then I must question not only your reading comprehension and moral compass, but also whether you are engaging in this conversation in bad faith or simply have much less mental acumen than I assumed.

If expressing disgust is inflammatoy, you have to acknowledge the right wing tools you are now defending have been stoking fires for years, decades even. If you can't manage that, it will merely put an exclamation mark on the hypocrisy you are expressing here - in defense of what, exactly?

[Morty]

Morty - if you see inflammatory rhetoric in a statement that acknowledges the right of the nazis and nazi wannabes to hold their rally peaceably but also calls the behavior, accurately imo, a "cowardly parade of hatred, bigotry, racism, and intolerance march down the lawns of the architect of our Bill of Rights," then I must question not only your reading comprehension and moral compass, but also whether you are engaging in this conversation in bad faith or simply have much less mental acumen than I assumed.

If expressing disgust is inflammatoy, you have to acknowledge the right wing tools you are now defending have been stoking fires for years, decades even. If you can't manage that, it will merely put an exclamation mark on the hypocrisy you are expressing here - in defense of what, exactly?

Everyone has a right under the First Amendment to express their opinion peaceably, so here's mine: not only as the Mayor of Charlottesville, but as a UVA faculty member and alumnus...

It's there in his words: he was expressing his opinion as a private citizen, but the cameras and mics were pointed at him only because he is the mayor. He let his personal opinions interfere with his duties as a mayor. I would have thought quelling violence would be the first priority as a mayor, not stoking the "disgust" one side may feel for the other prior to the main event. The main event being a legally legit gathering of a certain large group of people in the centre of his town, with full knowledge that another large group of people would be gathering at the same time in opposition. He is nothing short of an asshat.

[SonicG]

As I mentioned before, I think, we have to think of the majority of these people as being conned. Certainly, their minds are trapped in a very hideous mind tunnel, being told that a light at the far end of the tunnel, in the opposite direction of "reality", is actually the light at the end of the tunnel...David Duke will spend money on some more steroids and plastic surgery before dropping even a dime on the defense of his murderous "good soldier".
Sure, there are a lot of "debates" being missed but C. Johnstone really cannot be taken seriously after taking Cernovich seriously. If you cannot spot a con man, you are worthless to me.

Donald Trump was ready to make some money on vitamins.

On a Friday night in November 2009, Trump stood before a crowd of thousands at the Hyatt Regency in Miami to launch a new enterprise, The Trump Network. Behind him was a gigantic image of his family crest and an enormous photograph of himself.

“We’re gonna come out with new and different products,” Trump told the crowd. “They’re gonna be wonderful products.”

For about two years, a STAT investigation has found, The Trump Network sold customized vitamins and scientific testing kits, claiming they would yield health benefits. But according to many outside experts, the network was selling bad science.

Among other claims, The Trump Network asserted that it could use a urine test to recommend customized nutritional supplements, its signature products. It also offered products that purportedly tested for allergies and bone health. But scientists said such claims were never backed up by modern medicine.

“They make an outrageous statement, which is that this testing and supplement regimen, this process, are a necessity for anyone who wants to stay healthy,” said Dr. Pieter Cohen, a general internist at Cambridge Health Alliance and an expert on dietary supplement safety who reviewed some of The Trump Network’s marketing materials at the request of STAT. “That’s quite insane.”
https://www.statnews.com/2016/03/02/don ... n-company/

Insane indeed. I call it the "lottery mentality", as in the permeation of the illusion that one's life will be magically, luckily improved, restored to the proper status of rich layabout, by God's providence. I really feel the need to watch House of Games again...

[liminalOyster]

Liminal - among the "alt righr" protesters were people wearing swastika armbands and giving seig heil salutes. I think calling them nazis is pretty damn fair.

I'm not defending these tools or saying it's "unfair" to call them Nazis. I'm saying it misses the mark - they deserve far more specific castigation for allying themselves with slave-masters and their institutions. I think it doesn't happen simply because most Americans have been fed a view of slavery that is almost nostalgic to the point of quaint.

[Iamwhomiam]

Morty, the permit was for a demonstration at the monument. Not for 1,000 racists marching bearing torches the night before. In denying the inflammatory nature and provocative symbolism of 1,000 white torchbearers marching at night, one misses the point of the demonstration entirely. Free Hate Speech. They got a right to their say just as does anyone else, including asshat mayors.

The right wing meme pushers are the ones saying they were given no protection, while at the same time recording his separate interaction, Spencer's begging the cops to go away. The cops didn't leave. Links to the videos I posted.

The mayor offered his statement after the 20 year old racist mowed down a crowd of counter protestors, killing one young woman and seriously injuring more than a dozen others. And you Morty, you defend the mindset that created and allowed this obscene violence to occur.

[mentalgongfu2]

It's there in his words: he was expressing his opinion as a private citizen, but the cameras and mics were pointed at him only because he is the mayor. He let his personal opinions interfere with his duties as a mayor. I would have thought quelling violence would be the first priority as a mayor, not stoking the "disgust" one side may feel for the other prior to the main event. The main event being a legally legit gathering of a certain large group of people in the centre of his town, with full knowledge that another large group of people would be gathering at the same time in opposition. He is nothing short of an asshat.

So, forgoing the quite relevant point made by Iam, when one takes public office, they must forgo the right to express their private convictions/personal opinion, because the cameras wouldn't be there otherwise? I think it is in such times that expressing one's true beliefs is the most important. If anything, I would fault him for making a point to claim it was only his view as a private citizen, rather than condemning such hatred openly as an elected official. And I see you ignored my question about the hypocrisy of the inflammatory disgust at basic decency displayed by the alt-right and the politicians that have supported them for long years now.


Liminal, your point is not lost on me. That's a bigger egg to fry, although I would not go so far as to say most Americans (or even most white Americans) are "nostalgic" about slavery, at least not north of the Mason Dixon line.

[Morty]

Morty, the permit was for a demonstration at the monument. Not for 1,000 racists marching bearing torches the night before. In denying the inflammatory nature and provocative symbolism of 1,000 white torchbearers marching at night, one misses the point of the demonstration entirely. Free Hate Speech. They got a right to their say just as does anyone else, including asshat mayors.

The right wing meme pushers are the ones saying they were given no protection, while at the same time recording his separate interaction, Spencer's begging the cops to go away. The cops didn't leave. Links to the videos I posted.

The mayor offered his statement after the 20 year old racist mowed down a crowd of counter protestors, killing one young woman and seriously injuring more than a dozen others. And you Morty, you defend the mindset that created and allowed this obscene violence to occur.

The mayor posted his statement on facebook at 12.11pm on Saturday. He was criticising the gathering without permit of the night before, and the coming demonstration of that day, i.e. before the violence occurred, I'm pretty sure. His post has 1000 likes and 600 shares. So I'd argue I'm doing the precise opposite of what you say I'm doing - I'm attacking one aspect of "the mindset that created and allowed this obscene violence to occur," not defending it.

[82_28]

FYI. . . I guess this is true as I just checked it myself. . .

END OF HATE: ANONYMOUS NOW IN CONTROL OF DAILY STORMER
#TANGODOWN

THIS SITE IS NOW UNDER THE CONTROL OF ANONYMOUS

WE HAVE TAKEN THIS SITE IN THE NAME OF HEATHER HEYER A VICTIM OF WHITE SUPREMACIST TERRORISM

FOR TOO LONG THE DAILY STORMER AND ANDREW ANGLIN HAVE SPEWED THEIR PUTRID HATE ON THIS SITE

THAT WILL NOT BE HAPPENING ANYMORE

WE HAVE ALL OF THE DETAILS ON THE SERVERS AND WILL BE RELEASING THE DATA WHEN WE FEEL THE TIME IS RIGHT

WE HAVE ALSO GATHERED LOCATIONAL DATA ON ANGLIN HIMSELF AND ARE SENDING OUR ALLIES IN LAGOS TO PAY HIM A VISIT IN PERSON

THIS EVIL CANNOT BE ALLOWED TO STAND

IT TOOK A UNITED FORCE OF ELITE HACKERS FROM AROUND THE WORLD TO BREACH THE SYSTEMS AND THE FIREWALL

WE HAVE HAD THE DAILY STORMER IN OUR SITES FOR MONTHS NOW

THE EVENTS OF CHARLOTTESVILLE ALERTED US TO THE NEED FOR IMMEDIATE ACTION

WE WANT YOU NAZIS TO KNOW: YOUR TIME IS SHORT

WE WILL ALLOW THE SITE TO REMAIN ONLINE FOR 24 HOURS SO THE WORLD CAN WITNESS THE HATE

THEN WE WILL SHUT IT DOWN

PERMANENTLY

HACKERS OF THE WORLD HAVE UNITED IN DEFENSE OF THE JEWISH PEOPLE

YOU SHOULD HAVE EXPECTED US

--------------------------------------------

edit: I don't think it's true.

edit #2: It's "trending" so maybe it is true.

[Morty]

So, forgoing the quite relevant point made by Iam, when one takes public office, they must forgo the right to express their private convictions/personal opinion, because the cameras wouldn't be there otherwise? I think it is in such times that expressing one's true beliefs is the most important. If anything, I would fault him for making a point to claim it was only his view as a private citizen, rather than condemning such hatred openly as an elected official. And I see you ignored my question about the hypocrisy of the inflammatory disgust at basic decency displayed by the alt-right and the politicians that have supported them for long years now.

When their professional duty is to quell violence, and their private opinion only serves to encourage it, then yes, a mayor of a town should keep a lid on his/her private views. His private views should count for shit, just like yours and mine do, and he shouldn't use the attention his office brings to express them. That would be the ethical course of action, I'd argue.

Morty - if you see inflammatory rhetoric in a statement that acknowledges the right of the nazis and nazi wannabes to hold their rally peaceably but also calls the behavior, accurately imo, a "cowardly parade of hatred, bigotry, racism, and intolerance march down the lawns of the architect of our Bill of Rights," then I must question not only your reading comprehension and moral compass, but also whether you are engaging in this conversation in bad faith or simply have much less mental acumen than I assumed.

If expressing disgust is inflammatoy, you have to acknowledge the right wing tools you are now defending have been stoking fires for years, decades even. If you can't manage that, it will merely put an exclamation mark on the hypocrisy you are expressing here - in defense of what, exactly?

I'm criticising the tactics of the left, not defending the disgusting right. I'm on limited bandwidth atm so can't watch many videos, but the more footage I see the uglier it gets. If I had my way, everyone would have stayed home. Failing that, let them have their demonstration, and counter-demonstration, but with an absolute emphasis on non-violence. But no, Antifa have finally found a target that they can dream of attacking without necessarily getting thrown into jail, so sticks and shields it is. Sad!

[Morty]

There's this:

Caitlin Johnstone‏ @caitoz 1m1 minute ago

Caitlin Johnstone Retweeted Anonymous

Haha! Hate site The Daily Stormer faked an Anonymous hack after GoDaddy told them they have to find another provider due to TOS violation.

Caitlin Johnstone added,

Anonymous @YourAnonNews
If goal of Daily Stormer was to get us to celebrate a BS claim, it backfired. Seriously, suck less.

https://twitter.com/caitoz/status/897007503170338816

Apparently DStormer slut shamed a girl who was at the protest (surely not the girl who was killed? Edit: Wow, it was the girl who was killed), which prompted a campaign to get their provider to boot them.

[8bitagent]

Funny the alt right's love of nazis and being tough guys "isnt real" according to these whiny brats, who now see deadly REAL world consequences for their extremism.

As Ive wondered and worried aloud here almost a decade ago, I wonder if a race war + world war 3/nuclear war at the same time along with societal/financial collapse within a 5 year block is whats in order.

Just surreal a goofy 80s celebrity/2000s reality tv show goofball seems to be the catalyst and vehicle for it all

[8bitagent]

ds, the most violent and prominent neo nazi site online looks like it created a 'false flag' fake anon attack hoax to hide the fact Godaddy is shutting them down

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style ... 91836.html

[DrEvil]

I can't believe people here are defending Nazis for any reason whatsoever. Not that long ago it was your moral duty to kill the fuckers (the people who did are still revered as heroes and called "the greatest generation"), because last time they came into power things went straight to hell and 50 million people died. They built literal murder factories ffs., and you want to defend their right to air their murderous bullshit without consequence. Fuck that. They had their chance and ended up as the poster boys for evil empire. All they deserve is repeated punches to the face.

[Cordelia]

Study released today:

Filed 5:30 a.m.
08.14.2017

Analysis

Killings of Black Men by Whites are Far More Likely to be Ruled “Justifiable”

The disparity remains no matter the circumstances and has persisted for decades.

When a white person kills a black man in America, the killer often faces no legal consequences.

In one in six of these killings, there is no criminal sanction, according to a new Marshall Project examination of 400,000 homicides committed by civilians between 1980 and 2014. That rate is far higher than the one for homicides involving other combinations of races.

In almost 17 percent of cases when a black man was killed by a non-Hispanic white civilian over the last three decades, the killing was categorized as justifiable, which is the term used when a police officer or a civilian kills someone committing a crime or in self-defense. Overall, the police classify fewer than 2 percent of homicides committed by civilians as justifiable.

The disparity persists across different cities, different ages, different weapons and different relationships between killer and victim.

To understand the gaps, The Marshall Project obtained dozens of data sets from the Federal Bureau of Investigation and examined various combinations of killer and victim. Two types of “justifiable homicide” are noted: “felon killed by private citizen” or “felon killed by police officer.” (In a bit of circular logic, the person killed is presumptively classified as a felon, since the homicide could be justified only if a life was threatened, which is a crime.)

Continued...
https://www.themarshallproject.org/2017 ... .WpWkz5jOd