Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy attack

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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby JackRiddler » Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:54 pm

.

It is wonderful that they can agree on a chemical formula. I fully believe it. Somehow the unspecified toxic substance did indeed get into the victims' bloodstreams, almost surely by an assasssin's intent to kill one or more of them. There the reasonable consensus ends.

For this language also confirms that neither OPCW nor Porton Down knows how exactly it was made, where, or by whom. Also confirms that who delivered it is similarly unknown. In other words, there is confirmation that the warlike response and refusal to even allow a proper international investigation are unwarranted and reckless -- to the point of endangering everyone in the world. Because that's the situation we now find ourselves in with US-UK-NATO and Russia and Co.

And the headlines of the mainstream media calling this nonsense a "confirmation" of "novichok" are similarly reckless and untrue (certainly in the sense that they cannot know what they claim). If U.K. govt wants to call it "novichok," which is a category made public by its creator more than 20 years ago, fabulous. The only reason they're doing that is to make it sound Russian far more definitively than is the case.

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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby seemslikeadream » Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:56 pm

so can we all agree on two things

It's not been proven who did it and it wasn't the fish
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby Elvis » Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:54 am

"The executive summary released by the OPCW does not mention novichok by name, but states: “The results of the analysis by the OPCW designated laboratories of environmental and biomedical samples collected by the OPCW team confirms the findings of the United Kingdom relating to the identity of the toxic chemical that was used in Salisbury and severely injured three people.”


Could this be any more dodgy?

Who are the "designated laboratories"?
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby seemslikeadream » Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:05 am

OPCW Laboratory (LAB)

The OPCW Laboratory (LAB) is the OPCW’s centre of chemical analysis. Its work is key to ensuring correct implementation of the Chemical Weapons Convention (CWC). It works to ensure excellent technical and scientific support to the inspectorate, calibrating and testing analytical equipment and ensuring that inspections are carried out in accordance with the convention. It maintains the Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons (OPCW) Central Analytical Database (OCAD).
Core functions of LAB:
Achieve and maintain the accreditation of OPCW Laboratory;

Organize and conduct the Official OPCW Proficiency Tests twice per calendar year;
Ensure an excellent technical and scientific support, the calibration and testing of analytical inspection equipment, allowing execution of inspections in accordance with the Convention;
Organisation, maintaining and distribution of OPCW Central Analytical Database and extraction data for on-site inspections;
Provision of technical advice and support on analytical equipment-related issues and verification-related analytical issues;
Support for the training of Analytical Chemist Inspectors.
https://www.opcw.org/jobs/internships-a ... atory-lab/



confirms means confirms
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby Elvis » Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:10 am

Colin Powell at the UN at least cited "facts and conclusions based on solid intelligence" -- aka "this is bullshit!" as Powell more honestly described it in private.

NPR has been pretty good about referring to alleged or suspected gas attacks. But the next sentence invariably asks 'what the US military response' may be — a military response to an alleged, suspected attack.

Because it doesn't matter what excuse is used — any excuse will do. The "gas attack" excuse works well on the public because it evokes emotional responses.


Are we being asked to believe that — in this age of marketing and perception management — the U.S. has no propaganda campaign against Assad? That would be a first.
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby seemslikeadream » Fri Apr 13, 2018 10:14 am

oh sorry I thought we were talking about poisonous fish ...my bad\

but since we are going back in time

Scooter Libby for Chief of Staff or trump's new lawyer who can say? Ask DeGenova and his lovely wife Victoria aka Sticky Vicky and Schlubby Joe who pushed for the pardon

everything old is new again ...with a trump presidential pardon

On Oct. 28, 2005, a grand jury handed down a five-count indictment in the 22-month-long investigation into whether White House officials illegally leaked the identity of Valerie Plame, a covert CIA agent, in retaliation for public criticisms made by her husband, Joseph Wilson IV, about the Bush administration's case for invading Iraq.

.......

Vice President Cheney's top aide, Libby was found guilty of lying about his role in the leak of Plame's identity, two counts of perjury, one count of making false statements and one count of obstruction of justice on March 6, 2007. He was acquitted of a single count of lying to the FBI. On July 2, President Bush commuted Libby's sentence, after a federal appeals court refused to let Libby remain free while he appealed his conviction for lying to federal investigators.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/po ... ayers.html


The Plame Game: Was this a crime?
By Victoria Toensing and Bruce W. Sanford
January 12, 2005
http://www.digenovatoensing.com/the%20plame%20game.htm
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby MacCruiskeen » Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:21 pm

seemslikeadream » Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:56 pm wrote:so can we all agree on two things

It's not been proven who did it and it wasn't the fish


No, however much you may wish to pin this on the Russkies, we cannot agree that "it wasn't the fish". Nor have the testers themselves even remotedly ruled out food poisoning. They have referred only to an unnamed "toxic chemical" (sic), the origin of which they do not (in stark contrast to the UK's spooks, Tory govt and corporate media) even pretend to know.

Google search results: toxic chemicals seafood (About 472.000 results.)

A deadly serious business. See, for instance:



Or this, from 2002, on saxitoxin:

"Marine algal toxins: origins, health effects, and their increased occurrence"

"Over the past three decades, the frequency and global distribution of toxic algal incidents appear to have increased, and human intoxications from novel algal sources have occurred. This increase is of particular concern, since it parallels recent evidence of large-scale ecologic disturbances that coincide with trends in global warming."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1637787/


We don't know what made the Skripals sick, nor do we even know that it wasn't fish.

So what do we know? We know that Boris Johnson lied, we know that that fool of a British ambassador lied, we know that May and Macron made a predictable arse of themselves while rushing to demonstrate their obedience to their Transatlantic overlord, we know that Netanyahoo is still salivating at the prospect of more dead Syrians, we know that Donald fucking Trump and John fucking Bolton have pushed the world to the brink of WWIII (where it still hangs), we know that the corporate media are still a shower of mercenary and dishonest shits, and we know that both of the Skripals are still being held entirely incommunicado by the most repulsive UK government in living memory.
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby MacCruiskeen » Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:38 pm

General Jonathan Shaw, former commander of British Armed Forces in Iraq, gets cut off abruptly by Sky when he has the temerity to say the wrong thing:

https://twitter.com/EL4JC/status/984789066569998338
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby RocketMan » Fri Apr 13, 2018 12:40 pm

Thanks McCruiskeen for still trying at least. This board has a scary liberal-warmonger bent these days. Sad!

Out with the woo, in with the Realpolitik.
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby MacCruiskeen » Fri Apr 13, 2018 1:04 pm

Hi Rocket Man, good to see you here.

RocketMan » Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:40 am wrote:Thanks McCruiskeen for still trying at least. This board has a scary liberal-warmonger bent these days. Sad!


I agree. It's chronic amongst Americans especially, for whom war has traditionally been a spectator sport for at least the last 44 years, to be enjoyed from afar as a spectacle, via live satellite feed. I think there is a lot of actual brain damage around, and I think it's been induced, quite intentionally, by chronic media-addiction, which is a highly profitable business for some. And of course the culture itself is hyperviolent. One way or another, people are fast losing all ability to judge the quality or reliability of this shrill, depraved stuff they're being constantly bombarded with, on one screen or another, 24/7. You could call those deadly products nerve agents, were you so inclined.

Out with the woo, in with the Realpolitik.


If only it were even real! It's just woo, though. Bad-quality woo, Hollywood woo. Junk woo. It's second-hand third-rate superhero fantasy, the very opposite of imagination.

-----

I managed to embed that video, using another source from that tweet. So here's somebody real who knows something real about actual Realpolitik, making a valiant attempt to say something real about real international politics, before the fantasy-merchants shut him down unceremoniously after 71 seconds



https://youtu.be/zgj7gRvsjMU
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby norton ash » Fri Apr 13, 2018 1:34 pm

I'm a non-warmongering liberal who doesn't know what to believe anymore. Coulda been the Russians, coulda been somebody else's op. I don't think many 'liberals' here at RI really feel much casus belli in the belly.
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby NeonLX » Fri Apr 13, 2018 5:46 pm

RocketMan » Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:40 am wrote:...This board has a scary liberal-warmonger bent these days. Sad!


Hopefully, I can provide at least a little counterbalance to that.
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby Iamwhomiam » Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:36 pm

Yeah, it is a tough one, who poisoned the double agent. Was it the Reds, the Brits, or the Yanks? Or, was it the newly empowered and dastardly deadly mussel from the Red tide who done the dirty deed?
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby Elvis » Sat Apr 14, 2018 8:15 am

MacCruiskeen » Fri Apr 13, 2018 9:38 am wrote:General Jonathan Shaw, former commander of British Armed Forces in Iraq, gets cut off abruptly by Sky when he has the temerity to say the wrong thing:

https://twitter.com/EL4JC/status/984789066569998338


WOW. That's not a "sorry we're out of time..." — that's a "you can't say that here!"

Watch the Sky News woman cut him off. Utter censorship.

Alas, apparently one must go to RT to get the missing facts that cannot be uttered on MSM.
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Re: Skripal: Theresa May set to hit back Russia over spy att

Postby Iamwhomiam » Sat Apr 14, 2018 5:30 pm

Wow! Did I miss the news that Sky's sale to Disney went through? I mean, that was fantastic!
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