Coronavirus Crisis: Main Thread

[dada]

But this is exactly what I'm talking about, griz. Your response to my post through sharing a tweet. All you are doing is shutting down discussion with me. Getting up on the mass culture bully pulpit, and trying to knock me on the head with reshared tweets is not an argument for or against anything, it's just twitch response to trigger words you didn't "like."

And even stupiderly, the content of the reshared tweet doesn't have anything to do with the basic thrust of my argument. The analysis I'm presenting makes the question of "dark motives" irrelevant. It has nothing to do with whether or not behaviors are above board. Not that people aren't capable of doing bad things for worse reasons, but the thread topic could be much more fruitful if we left that kind of gossipy billionaire fanboy speculation out of it.

The topic can be approached without all the mass culture, social media noise surrounding it. I'd say it actually can't be approached other than as a game, otherwise. Not really looking for answers, but plugging and playing, the endless search, dig up bone, copy paste share. Maybe it gives you some kind of social satisfaction to participate in the daily ritual, I don't know. But I just see it as a complete waste of time.

[Belligerent Savant]

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Congratulate yourself for being a willing stooge.

My turn:
I'm un-'vaccinated'. Will avoid it at all costs. Barely ever wore a mask, certainly not outdoors. I've traveled a number of times over the past year, including by plane (and while on the plane, I held my drink near my face for extended periods to avoid wearing the mask). I haven't gotten ill. My family members don't wear masks either. They haven't gotten ill. I've gone outside almost daily since the onset of this propaganda campaign -- walking, jogging, bike riding -- enjoying the sun and fresh air. Only change to my habits over the past year is that I've taken vitamin D more regularly (when not absorbing it naturally while outdoors) along with Vitamin C (mostly from citrus) and Zinc for periods of time.

Are there outlandish theories out there? Sure. Misdirections, limited hangouts, mis/disinformation, poisoned wells and red herrings abound. But that doesn't mean lies aren't being told by govts or bureaucrats, or that crimes against humanity aren't being perpetrated. Or that these 'vaccines' aren't part of a sinister campaign.

Carry on, dutiful soldier.

P.S. - of course this virus will be back later this year. It's endemic now, like all other viruses. But it's FAR less harmful than advertised, and in any event, most have either naturally-acquired immunity/antibodies, or will reportedly have lessened symptoms due to the supposed benefit of these experimental shots (that is, if your immunity isn't markedly compromised as part of the numerous adverse effects -- it will be interesting to see what happens later this year. Any serious adverse side effects resulting from these shots will simply be attributed back to covid, of course -- par for the course.)

By the way, neither you or dada answered Jack's earlier question:

dada, freemason9, can you point to examples of current and recent posts that you consider Q-talk?

Point to examples or STFU.

Well, your rhetoric is sort of Q-Anonish. It denies the chaotic nature of pathogens in our world, and attributes COVID-19 severity to some kind of conspiratorially planned messaging that exaggerates the danger. To what end? The whole idea is ridiculous. Just listen to science. Listen to knowledgeable researches and epidemiologists. Let them do their jobs, they are smart and good people.

WTF does "Q-Anonish" mean? How do you define it? Or is it simply, "anything that strays from status quo/mainstream talking points"?

I -- and others here -- have been following science-based analysis and findings. You, on the other hand, have clearly been following propagandized 'The Science', which lacks merit/substance/validity upon sober assessment.

By all means, present your version of 'science', and attempt to rebuke any of the content I've presented in this thread, which, by the way, regularly included content from scientists, doctors and physicians.

You are displaying nothing more than blind adherence to whatever it is you're told by Establishment Channels. But you have an opportunity to show me otherwise: that you've actually performed a measure of due diligence.

[dada]

The visual representation of my argument, is something like a narrow strip of beach with some sandbars, filled with beachcombers bumping past one another, metal detectors clinking together like cheap souveneir swords. Someone once found a watch in the sand, now the others migrated in a gold rush fever, on the chance they might find a valuable object dropped by someone else.

They are so absorbed in the lazy "thrill of the hunt," that they stopped paying attention to the wind and wave patterns behind them indicating a sea change, and before you can even post-click "submit," they are washed away in the swell tides of mass production.

[dada]

"WTF does "Q-Anonish" mean? How do you define it? Or is it simply, "anything that strays from status quo/mainstream talking points"

I've only just defined a meaning for the term a few posts ago. It's a narrative flow, storyframe of elite controllers manipulating society and brainwashing consumers with technocratic wizardry.

We understand that this type of narrative is utopian/dystopian fantasy, and doesn't accurately portray the way the world works at all. It only lives as a mass cultural conceit, and as such is isolated and prevented from participating in the more comprehensive analysis. But the bubble can't sustain itself indefinitely, and pops on contact with dialogue between actual, active thinkers.

[dada]

It's the difference between saying "I reject the elite's narrative," and not accepting elite narratives as a useful reality-parsing frame.

Saying "accepting the elites narrative," and "rejecting the elite's narrative," come to the same thing, dystopian fiction. Both accept the mass culture class structure as immutable reality, taking the mass culture narrative as the baseline. Elite narratives are then only useful to mass culture, as a way to define its existence devoid of any uncomfortable conclusions that would come from taking a serious look at the real matters of economy and class that will not go away. And so the mass cultural, dystopian elite narrative is always absent any mention of the overwhelming role of economy and mass culture class structure, itself, in shaping the subject at hand.

[Belligerent Savant]

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My inquiry was directed at freemason.

In any event, however you or freemason choose to define this construct, it isn't applicable to any of the content I presented in this thread.

It's a misrepresentation, a misdirection, and all it does, here, is demonstrate how it can be appropriated by dupes/consumers of certain types of information exactly as intended: to distract from relevant/pertinent analysis and lines of inquiry.

[Karmamatterz]

Ascribing this discussion to Qanon is part of the way this narrative is managed. So many are deeply brainwashed that they don't recognize they are parroting exactly what the media is serving up directly from the bureaucrats and pharma marketing departments. These very tropes to label those that question authority as conspiracy theorists or now member of Q are an embarrassment for this board. That is the sort of commentary I expect from Facebook and the establishment media.

Belligerent Savant and others have provided plenty of information that is enlightening and casts a dark cloud over the official narrative, the doublespeak, doublethink and mind fuckery that has been shoved down our throats and jabbed into people's arms. I don't care if you got the experimental drug or not, enjoy it! Just don't expect folks on RI to bend over and take another dose of the bullshit authoritarian messaging at face value.

[dada]

It isn't for me to convince you one way or another. Asking the reader, "is it real, or utopian fiction," leaving it up to the reader to decide, or not, is actually a big selling point for the form. Good examples of the form are ones that blur the line the best.

But the point isn't that we "agree to disagree," its that dystopian elite narrative has no place in a dialogue with my analysis of virus.

[dada]

"Ascribing this discussion to Qanon is part of the way this narrative is managed"

Not here, it isn't. We're not on social media, reproducing the mass consumer culture, we're putting this idea that the dystopian elite narrative style is outside of mass culture to rest. Saying it is a mass product, and no different from the mass product it purports to be different from.

So we're not "managing the narrative," here on this message board we're lumping it in with the rest of mass culture, and assessing the value of all mass cultural output as nil.

[dada]

I mean, the discussion on this thread pivots between "resist the elite's narrative!" and defenses of the resist the elite's narrative against other mass cultural products. Always ignoring the appeals to adopt a more comprehensive analysis, never getting around to addressing the actual, worthwhile topics under examination. Economy's overwhelming role in the production of crisis, and the mass culture class structure taken as a whole, as maintainer and reproducer of the social failures that break our hearts.

[JackRiddler]

Ascribing this discussion to Qanon is part of the way this narrative is managed.

Like it or not, not the apparently defunct Qanon operation (which I'd bet money was an adjunct to the Trump campaign) but the subculture that adopted Qanon has now occupied dissent from the dominant Covid/Lockdown/vaccination narrative and thus hindering its growth. In the same way, Alex Jones and no-plane/no-victim claims occupied 9/11 skepticism and guaranteed it would be discredited (though of course that was overdetermined). It's naive to pretend this can be ignored or treated as a mere nuisance. It is just as naive to presume that every statement from the 'authoritarian' dominant narrative is simply the 180-degree opposite of the truth, and that everyone claiming this can be trusted in their full package of claims.

While downtown yesterday, a small band on Sixth Avenue conducted the first anti-lockdown protest -- a yell-out, I guess it could be called -- that I've witnessed personally in New York. They were walking along screaming at people at random (for a while through a bullhorn) and calling them sheep and such for... eating in the outdoor structures granted to restaurants instead of inside, on a summery evening. I'm pretty sure most who saw this did not understand what their issues were supposed to be. If their mission had been to alienate everyone seeing them with incoherence and aggressive insults and condescension, they couldn't have done a better job. This is the opposite of movement building.

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[Belligerent Savant]

Like it or not, not the apparently defunct Qanon operation (which I'd bet money was an adjunct to the Trump campaign) but the subculture that adopted Qanon has now occupied dissent from the dominant Covid/Lockdown/vaccination narrative and thus hindering its growth. In the same way, Alex Jones and no-plane/no-victim claims occupied 9/11 skepticism and guaranteed it would be discredited (though of course that was overdetermined). It's naive to pretend this can be ignored or treated as a mere nuisance. It is just as naive to presume that every statement from the 'authoritarian' dominant narrative is simply the 180-degree opposite of the truth, and that everyone claiming this can be trusted in their full package of claims.

"It's naive to pretend this can be ignored or treated as a mere nuisance."
-- mischaracterization, and nonsense, in this fucking venue. Or is this just a variant of DU now? We should expect better quality from RI members.
Though perhaps in this respect you're right: we shouldn't expect better quality. This is, indeed -- demonstrably -- not the RI of old.

"It is just as naive to presume that every statement from the 'authoritarian' dominant narrative is simply the 180-degree opposite of the truth, and that everyone claiming this can be trusted in their full package of claims."
- this is strawman-esque, as no one here has indicated or suggested this, but frankly, right now l'd say MOST of the dominant narrative is straight up disinfo/conditioning/fear-mongering. Far too much noise, very little signal.

[dada]

I'm saying that in the language of the more comprehensive analysis, elite narrative is mass produced dystopian fiction. By attempting to engage with the analysis in the language of mass culture, a response may have the appearance of being in dialogue with it, but is actually still in dialogue with the mass culture, in effect talking to itself.

Maybe in dialogue with impressions of past interactions within mass culture. But to be in dialogue with the more comprehensive analysis would mean speaking the same language of economy and class, the only way to successfully engage in the transgressive cultural narrative. A narrative that is not "elite," just by being successively engaging.

[JackRiddler]

Though perhaps in this respect you're right: we shouldn't expect better quality. This is, indeed -- demonstrably -- not the RI of old.[/b]

You were easily in the top 3 complaining about "the RI of old," which was dominated to the exclusion of all other content by daily flooding from certain posters whom you constantly yanged about; as did I.

"Not the RI of old" is of course the perennial complaint, dating back through the whole history of this site. Now that you're literally the leading poster, are you saying that you're the problem? (Note: You don't flood, and this comment is merely me as a poster calling out bullshit, not a mod message.)

It is just as naive to presume that every statement from the 'authoritarian' dominant narrative is simply the 180-degree opposite of the truth, and that everyone claiming this can be trusted in their full package of claims.

- this is strawman-esque, as no one here has indicated or suggested this...

Several users here do exactly this, but I wasn't thinking of or talking to you. Why do you feel addressed?

but frankly, right now l'd say MOST of the dominant narrative is straight up disinfo/conditioning/fear-mongering. Far too much noise, very little signal.

I say the same. That still doesn't mean that truth is the 180-degree opposite of the dominant disinfo (which is what I actually said), which of course often relies on true facts in its construction.

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[dada]

So much for comprehensive analysis.

So we've established how the information produced in mass culture for and by the "resist technocratic elite control!" demographic is similar to the Qanon game. Both are products of mass culture, and not at all "outside the norm."

I guess what it comes down to is there is Qanon-ish, and there is Qbert. Qberts always hop to the top. The Qanon-ish bound to get lost.