Marionumber1 » 28 Oct 2022 00:16 wrote:DrEvil » Thu Oct 27, 2022 12:52 pm wrote:"Russia's invasion is not justified, but...".
There it is again, the excuses for war.
Feel free to point out where I made "excuses for war" (and good luck, because you won't find it). Pointing out the culpability of the US empire — especially when that subject has largely evaded coverage in the mainstream — in escalating the situation to this point does not mean I think it was acceptable for Russia to respond with an invasion.
You're critical of seeking a negotiated end to the war, but if that's off the table for you, I'm curious what the alternative is in your mind. Are the continuing casualties to combatants on both sides as well as civilians worth it? And if Ukraine should just keep fighting, do you believe the US should also continue supplying them with financial and military aid? Supposing Ukraine wins in the end, will your response be "Great, now Ukraine is truly sovereign and free", or will you continue being just as vocal against Ukraine's CIA-installed neo-Nazi government as you are against Russia's invasion?
It's easy to say what should have been the case in this conflict, but that would require changing history so that the US/NATO and Russia both respected Ukraine's sovereignty from the beginning. Neither of them did, and now we live in the world as it is, not as we wish it was. So what is the best way to get out of this without making the global situation more dangerous and without perpetuating war any longer?Was Ukraine threatening to invade Russia? War is what you do as an absolute last resort in self defense, not something you do because you don't like their political landscape or their future potential as a threat or how someone else is meddling in their politics. By your logic the US was justified in their meddling and general fuckery with South American countries that got too friendly with the Soviet Union. The Bay of Pigs was totally okay, just poorly executed. They just had a very bloody coup with Soviet support, and it's right on America's doorstep.
It may shock you to know that I have made arguments along these lines against alt media types who do support Russia's invasion, because, guess what, I don't support it.Fixed that for you. I must have missed the part where the US annexed parts of Ukraine.
My bad, they only ousted the president (in violation of Ukraine's constitution), used paramilitaries (largely from the far-right/neo-Nazi contingent) to suppress dissent, and installed handpicked (by the State Department's current fourth-in-command Victoria Nuland) members of the new government. "Obviously" that is so much different.
I agree 100% with you on all of this. It's nice to find an oasis of sanity in the midst of all the "leftist" "anti-imperialistic" war lovers I have encountered online.