'EcoFascism' and related Acts of Criminality.

[stickdog99]

Right.

While multinational corporations relocate to China and India where they burn more and more coal every year then use millions of metric tons fossil fuels to ship the crap they make back to Western nations, we all clamor for further laws forcing regular citizens to eat bugs, suffer blackouts, give up private cars, and stay locked in our neighborhoods "to save the planet" all to somehow appease our corporate media graven image of an angry Gaia who demands our personal self-sacrifice.

[Elvis]

we all clamor for further laws forcing regular citizens to eat bugs

Again, who is "we all"?

[Elvis]

Are you guys saying that the corporate right is NOT a doomsday cult? Exxon is a noble truth-teller, exposing the left's lies about climate change?

Really?



Also,

the TOP priority is to curb such emissions from the largest polluters: mega corporations, multinational entities, and countries like China and India that are far more egregious in this regard than the U.S

Who is driving demand for Chinese production? Not least, it's US consumers. But you seem to say that no change is required on the part US consumers.

[Belligerent Savant]

.
Speaking only for myself: the concerns with the activities of Corps like Exxon is the impact on the environment, and pollution concerns -- NOT climate.

However popular or not the above notion may be, here or elsewhere, I do NOT subscribe to the premise that human-generated CO2 (or ANY form of CO2, for that matter) causes 'climate change'. This is one of numerous integral and (relatively) long-standing canards of the current age.

Exxon is far from alone in creating pollution and/or environmental harms as a multinational corporate/conglomerate. The 'Green New Deal', unfortunately, will not solve 'climate change' as none of its solutions will positively impact the climate (but it will make the very few even wealthier than they already are, and cause excessive harms in the process). Nor will it benefit most of the struggling classes in the world, especially given that gas heat remains the cheapest, scalable and most readily accessible form of energy for the vast majority (AND also: "green energy" relies HEAVILY on gas, oil, carbon-based fuels in the manufacture, supply chain, operation and maintenance of 'green' alternatives, and also is a net negative to the environment).

I must be a madman, eh?

I assure you that I'd much prefer your version of reality than the version I'm presenting here.

A couple snippets for consideration:

NEW - Almost 16 million trees have been chopped down in Scotland to make way for wind farms.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/20 ... -scotland/

SNP admits to felling 16 million trees to develop wind farms
Scottish Tory MSP Liam Kerr said figure would astonish the public and communities all over the country had cited concerns about the projects

https://twitter.com/disclosetv/status/1 ... 36416?s=20

And this:

Destroying the Earth in the Name of "Green Energy"



“Green” Energy is Destroying the Planet

As a miner for 40 years, I have worked in various mines around the world. Gold, platinum, copper, coal, lead, zinc, oil and salt. I'm going to tell you something, and here it is. We will destroy the earth in the name of "Green Energy" Follow along and I will explain.

MiningWatch Canada is estimating that “[Three] billion tons of mined metals and minerals will be needed to power the energy transition” – a “massive” increase especially for six critical minerals: lithium, graphite, copper, cobalt, nickel and rare earth minerals

Over the next 30 years 7.5 billion of us, we will consume more minerals than the last 70,000 years or the past 500 generations, which is more than all of the 108 billion humans who have ever walked the Earth.

Mining requires the extraction of solid ores, often after removing vast amounts of overlying rock. Then the ore must be processed, creating an enormous quantity of waste – about 100 billion tonnes a year, more than any other human-made waste stream.

Purifying a single tonne of rare earths requires using at least 200 cubic meters of water, which then becomes polluted with acids and heavy metals. On top of that, imagine the destruction and energy required to obtain these essential metals:

18,740 pounds of purified rock to produce 2.2 pounds of vanadium
35,275 pounds of ore for 2.2 pounds of cerium
110,230 pounds of rock for 2.2 pounds of gallium
2,645,550 pounds of ore to get 2.2 pounds of lutecium
Also staggering amounts of ore are needed for other metals.

By 2035, demand is expected to double for germanium; quadruple for tantalum; and quintuple for palladium. The scandium market could increase nine-fold, and the cobalt market by a factor of 24. (Marscheider-Wiedemann 2016, Raw Materials for Emerging Technologies).

The potential demand for rare metals is exponential. We are already consuming over two billion tonnes of metals every year — the equivalent of more than 500 Eiffel Towers a day.

There is nothing refined about mining. It involves crushing rock, and then using a concoction of chemical reagents such as sulphuric and nitric acid, a long and highly repetitive process using many different procedures to obtain a rare-earth concentrate close to 100% purity.

As rare metals have become ubiquitous in green and digital technologies, the exceedingly toxic sludge they produce has been contaminating water, soil, the atmosphere, and the flames of blast furnaces.

Do you think solar panels are “Green,” think again. There is nothing green about solar panels. Did you know we clear cut forests, not for panel placement but for the wood needed to produce the panels. Don't believe me, have a read.

https://hiddenhistorycenter.org/wp-cont ... Panels.pdf

I have seen the destruction of mountains, lakes and pristine waterways all in the name of #GreenEnergy. A recent report by the Blacksmith Institute identifies the mining industry as the second-most-polluting industry in the world. Soon to be Number # 1 Why? Green energy.



Wind turbines guzzle more raw materials than previous technologies:

For an equivalent installed capacity, solar and wind facilities require up to 15 times more concrete, 90 times more aluminum, and 50 times more iron, copper, and glass than fossil fuels or nuclear energy.

Think of China. One-fifth of China’s arable land is polluted from mining and industry. Mining the materials needed for renewable energy potentially affects 50 million square kilometers, 37% of Earth’s land (minus Antarctica). Now imagine that number 10 fold.

“Recycling” Solar Panels is Absurd

Each panel is a toxic cocktail of gallium arsenide, tellurium, silver, crystalline silicon, lead, cadmium and other heavy metals. As it leeches into the water table, it’s not difficult to imagine the effect on water supplies, the environment and human health. #GreenEnergy

The cost of solar panel recycling is high, resulting in solar panels ending up in landfills. It costs an estimated $20 to $30 to recycle one solar panel, which compares to a cost of $1 to $2 for sending that same panel to a landfill.

The International Renewable Energy Agency (IRENA)’s official projections claim that “large amounts of annual waste are anticipated by the early 2030s” and could total 78 million metric tons by 2050 By 2035, discarded solar panels could outweigh new units sold by 2.56 times.

Harvard Business Review; the levelized cost of solar could be four times the current projection when solar waste is factored into the calculation. The U.S. government does not have a PV recycling policy and as such most solar waste ends up in landfills. This is not “Green.”

https://bfrandall.substack.com/p/destro ... n-the-name

Caveat Lector -- assess or corroborate (or disregard) the above as deemed fit.

These are merely representative samples. The prior ~10 or so pages of this thread has other content related to my current position Re: "climate alarm"/"climate change" (and there's ample data out there that can be found, of course, to help inform one's position)

[Belligerent Savant]

Came across this interview today.

7 minute clip comparing the covid 'crisis' with the climate 'crisis' (and censorship, "consensus", "The Science", etc.)

The climate-related comments start at about the 3:45min mark:



Sample transcript:

~3:40 mark:

Interviewer:
okay, so you are seeing the the pandemic crisis as also a tool for some political views...
could you make a parallel with the the climate, the climate fear that that was existing before and still existing now and it seems to be, uh, stronger and stronger. What do you see, do you think there is a parallel between both covid and and climate?

Response:
yes, let's let's take a step back; the general rule of thumb that I believe everybody should adopt is that if any problem is being presented as a global crisis, then it is a scam, and the pattern that we are confronted with is really the fabrication of global crises; the presentation either of non-existent problems, or small local problems as being General Global crises. That fabrication is followed by the assertion that the only solutions that are permissible are Global ones that require a global Authority, Global control. That is the general pattern that we are up against.

The covid policy response was one of those; look at what happened to countries like Sweden or Tanzania who try to push back against the Orthodoxy, the new Orthodoxy, and the the climate crisis. The climate change crisis is another example where we are told that the biggest threat to the world is this molecule CO2, and that an increase in the level of this molecule will cause an increase in temperature and that that temperature increase will be bad for us and that the only thing we can do is consume fewer fossil fuels fuels and less energy. That's fitting the pattern exactly. The other things you can observe is instead of presenting science as an ongoing evolving activity, it is presented in terms of static knowledge, consensus, and you see the cancellation and censorship of dissident voices, rather than engagement with them. These patterns are proof of a scam.

That is what people need to understand: whenever something is presented as The Science, as a consensus, it is a scam. You do not have to go and get engaged in all of the minutia of the scientific principles and the models and the measurements at all; you can know with absolute certainty that you are dealing with a scam when dissent is suppressed.

Interviewer:

I think that people are thinking that scientific consensus is the same as scientific processes, this is not the same thing

Response:

It's absolutely not the same thing. Science works on the principle that all the explanations that we have for how the world works will eventually be replaced with better ones, and that process happens in an evolutionary way in the world of competing ideas

as explanations are tested, and found to represent reality in a way that is wrong... there's a creative process in the sciences where new ideas, new explanations, alternate explanations step in to fill the gap left by the ones that have been [shown to be false], and that evolutionary process is fundamental to science and is completely contradicted by the very notion of 'consensus science' or 'following the science'.

[Elvis]

I do NOT subscribe to the premise that human-generated CO2 (or ANY form of CO2, for that matter) causes 'climate change'.

Facinating. Thanks.

[Belligerent Savant]

@cordeliers

Being in Sicily during the current climate scam reminds me of living half a mile from Elmhurst General, the “epicenter of the epicenter,” and confirming with my own eyes that the hysterical propaganda was a tissue of outrageous lies.

Yet in both cases many people thought that apocalyptic headlines and lurid memes were more credible than eyewitness accounts.

6:12 AM · Jul 26, 2023
...
Actual temperature in Sicily (33 km from supposedly infernal Palermo: 34° C. A pleasant evening ahead.



...

Today it’s clear, pleasantly breezy, just shy of 30°



8:13 AM · Jul 26, 2023

https://twitter.com/cordeliers/status/1 ... 33985?s=20

https://twitter.com/cordeliers/status/1 ... 41632?s=20

[Grizzly]

[Elvis]

Sicily engulfed by 55 fires
“We have never seen anything like it,” a San Martino delle Scale resident told Italy’s Ansa news agency. “We were surrounded by fire. We could not go anywhere. We spent the night in the square. These were terrible moments.”


https://twitter.com/MintPressNews/statu ... 0150795271

[Belligerent Savant]

.
Ah yes - fires.

‘Climate change’ causing spontaneous combustion.

The things that will be believed by default in this era, eh?

While I don’t claim to know with any measure of certainty what may actually be happening in Sicily, since I’m not there at the moment, there is also this as added consideration, typed by an account handle, Cordeliers, who claims to be in Sicily, currently, and shared photos from his window view (see my prior posting above):

Club des Cordeliers
@cordeliers

Slap together scary images to create a wildly misleading impression of Sicily, add maudlin text, get hundreds of retweets. The poster is plainly a sock puppet activating a warehoused account (joined January 2012; 66 followers.) Panic porn pushing the ruling class climate agenda.

https://twitter.com/cordeliers/status/1 ... 18944?s=20

And:

Club des Cordeliers
@cordeliers

Video, said to have been shot yesterday in Palermo, appears to show drive-by arson. As in Greece, I suspect fires were set as part of a coordinated climate propaganda campaign.

Lucia_rogito ergo sum_ Maria Natale
@Lucia37603819

Vi presento il cambiamento climatico.

[Video at Twitter Link below]

#palermo ieri @boni_castellane @CriticaScient @GandolfoDomini1
@fdragoni

https://twitter.com/cordeliers/status/1 ... 98400?s=20

For those that don’t read Italian, the above tweet essentially states, “we present to you ‘climate change’ “, along with a video clip of what looks like arson taking place.

Ceveat Lector.

Also, FWIW: I have family in Naples right now - they note no such indications of extreme temps in Sicily (or rather: no such 'extreme weather' beyond what's expected for the region -- certainly not the type of weather that would cause spontaneous fires ) after communicating and inquiring with friends in the area of Sicily.

[Joe Hillshoist]

Wow. You are an idiot.

[Joe Hillshoist]

Firstly the vast majority of fires are started by human interaction.

In Australia on days of total fire ban (something we've had since long before climate change was a public idea,) everyday activities like mowing or slashing with a metal blade, or outdoor work with angle grinders and welders is banned. In SE Australia, with its fire prone environment and Mediterranean climate people understand this and mostly take care not to accidentally start fires. People still do it, obviously, but the ban is there and if you start a fire that damages someone's stuff because you were mowing or welding you're responsible for the damage. If someone is hurt or killed you're responsible.

There have also been jerks who like lighting fires around forever.

We used to have arsonists drive around here throwing out fuel soaked rags every 500 metres at times. Most of them are lucky they never got caught by anyone.

Hot dry conditions also promote static discharge, ie dry lightning and clear sky lightning.

So get that - The weather conditions that make fires more likely and more serious also promote events that ignite fires. At times you'd swear it was some sort of non human intervention.

Secondly - what are the weather conditions like in Sicily - well in Palermo they're 31-38 Deg C over the next few days.

The humifity is high, in the 50s, so not conducive to fires, not completely inhibitive either. Dunno what the relative humidity is either or the degree of curing in the dry fuel in the area.

But its summer in the Mediterranean do it is probably low RH and high curing of grasses and other dry fuel.

And if you go visit that other (15 year old,) RI thread on climate change you'll find me pointing out that these fires are happening in some of these areas regularly now but it was pretty rare even late last century every summer for years at a time.

Who cares if its arsonists lighting fires to convince people of climate change anyway?

What difference does it make?

If the fires are unusual and dangerous fire conditions more common than they used to be then that's the problem.

You can't light a wildfire if the conditions aren't right. You can try as much as you like but it just won't happen.

[Belligerent Savant]

.
"Who cares"? So, blatant acts of propaganda are of no interest to you then, eh?

'Climate change' is not the cause for many of these fires, Joe. These fires are not fucking 'unusual' -- in most scenarios, it's arson; or factors that aren't any more or less 'unusual' than similar fire incidents in history, before the barrage of 'climate change' BS; or simply straight up fucking lies/gross exaggerations.

But by all means, keep holding on -- a number of you simply prefer to keep with your own tightly-held narratives.

Why is media and govt in overdrive pushing this bullshit propaganda? If you don't care then no need to reply, though such brazen propaganda will absolutely impact the collective (as it already has).

This 'Cordeliers'* person, currently in Palermo, must be an 'idiot' as well (unless Cordeliers is lying and obtaining the below photos from elsewhere, during another time period; I'll take his word over the word of 'authority'/news media/trolls on social media right now).

*I've been following his account for much of the last few years and never noticed an instance of him being anything but earnest in his commentary, however wrong or right his takes are.

Of course I always remain aware that my take may be wrong, in part or in whole. But the passage of time tends to strengthen my positions.

Do any of you entertain the notion that you may be flat wrong?

Club des Cordeliers
@cordeliers

Propaganda tweet on the left: Palermo is hell. My photo on the right: Palermo is a hell of a town. Beautiful day in a great city that shows no signs of climate catastrophe.





4:29 AM · Jul 27, 2023

...

Somebody needs to tell these tourists that they’re in the midst of a climate apocalypse. #Palermo



...

Perfect weather in #Palermo.



(Note the temp reading on the 'green cross' to the left. 28 degrees C.)

...

Quattro Canti mobbed as always.



...

Where’s the fire? #Palermo

https://twitter.com/cordeliers/status/1 ... 42912?s=20

.

And here we have another anecdote, audio/video taken from a plane flight. (It seems I also stumbled across Mac's twitter handle. Glad I did.)

COUPVID
@MacCruiskeenJr
·
Jul 26

#Rhodes seen from an airliner cockpit, 25 July 2023.

In the last few seconds of the clip, the pilot says, in Swiss German:

"Yet the media are telling us the whole island is burning. It's nuts. They're talking such crap."

Gerald Neuwirth
@GeraldNeuwirth

Das „Flammeninferno von Rhodos“ am 25.07.23 aus Sicht eines Linienpiloten.

Gut zuhören.

[VIDEO at Twitter link]

https://twitter.com/MacCruiskeenJr/stat ... 55779?s=20

[Joe Hillshoist]

.
"Who cares"? So, blatant acts of propaganda are of no interest to you then, eh?

'Climate change' is not the cause for many of these fires, Joe. These fires are not fucking 'unusual' -- in most scenarios, it's arson; or factors that aren't any more or less 'unusual' than similar fire incidents in history, before the barrage of 'climate change' BS; or simply straight up fucking lies/gross exaggerations.

You don't know what you're talking about. And you can't read. I said the vast majority of fires are caused by human activity. Some are caused by atmospheric conditions that promote static discharge, ie thunder with no rain.

The weather determines what happens after a fire starts. The average of weather conditions over a long period of time is climate. When, over decades fires become more common or more severe that is because the climate changes.

Even if it is arson causing these fires, why are you assuming arson is being used to push climate change propaganda/ Have you got any evidence for that? How do you know people lighting these fires aren't involved in feuds, scamming insurance or just have a hard on for out of control fires?

You don't, you just have a worldview in your head that you want to dogmatically push on people and won't stabnd any criticism. You were raised a Catholic right?

This place is called Rigorous Intuition cos once upon a time people used rigor - they put up ideas expecting them to be picked apart if they had logical flaws. You're incapable of that by the looks of things. You're too much of a snowflake to take on any criticism and you can't think outside the boxes you built for your thoughts to be placed in.

But by all means, keep holding on -- a number of you simply prefer to keep with your own tightly-held narratives.

Why is media and govt in overdrive pushing this bullshit propaganda? If you don't care then no need to reply, though such brazen propaganda will absolutely impact the collective (as it already has).

This 'Cordeliers'* person, currently in Palermo, must be an 'idiot' as well (unless Cordeliers is lying and obtaining the below photos from elsewhere, during another time period; I'll take his word over the word of 'authority'/news media/trolls on social media right now).

*I've been following his account for much of the last few years and never noticed an instance of him being anything but earnest in his commentary, however wrong or right his takes are.

Of course I always remain aware that my take may be wrong, in part or in whole. But the passage of time tends to strengthen my positions.

Do any of you entertain the notion that you may be flat wrong?

Club des Cordeliers
@cordeliers

Propaganda tweet on the left: Palermo is hell. My photo on the right: Palermo is a hell of a town. Beautiful day in a great city that shows no signs of climate catastrophe.





4:29 AM · Jul 27, 2023

...

Somebody needs to tell these tourists that they’re in the midst of a climate apocalypse. #Palermo



...

Perfect weather in #Palermo.



(Note the temp reading on the 'green cross' to the left. 28 degrees C.)

...

Quattro Canti mobbed as always.



...

Where’s the fire? #Palermo

https://twitter.com/cordeliers/status/1 ... 42912?s=20

.

And here we have another anecdote, audio/video taken from a plane flight. (It seems I also stumbled across Mac's twitter handle. Glad I did.)

COUPVID
@MacCruiskeenJr
·
Jul 26

#Rhodes seen from an airliner cockpit, 25 July 2023.

In the last few seconds of the clip, the pilot says, in Swiss German:

"Yet the media are telling us the whole island is burning. It's nuts. They're talking such crap."

Gerald Neuwirth
@GeraldNeuwirth

Das „Flammeninferno von Rhodos“ am 25.07.23 aus Sicht eines Linienpiloten.

Gut zuhören.

[VIDEO at Twitter link]

https://twitter.com/MacCruiskeenJr/stat ... 55779?s=20[/quote]

People exaggerate. especially when it comes to fires,

See this song for proof:




None the less if you're near the small fires that happened in Sicily five days ago and aren't used to fires they would be very hot, especially if you're within 100m of them, they'd be smokey and they'd change your immediate environment very quickly, so people would freak out, but those fires are out now. That's why there is no smoke in Palermo on whatever day those nice photos were taken.

but it was only mid/high 30s, the wind was under 50km/hr and the humidity was not very low. So those fires would have been put out within a short period of time. They're not crowning unchecked thru thousands of square miles of forest.

Unlike the ones to the NW of you that have burned an unprecedented tens of millions of acres and show no signs of going out until it rains or they burn to the coast.

Its funny that you haven't mentioned them.

Don't fit your narrative?

[Grizzly]