FBI agent kills man linked to Boston bombing suspects

[hiddenite]

Its a big deal if there's one standard for some people and another for others, especially if the decision is based on how someone felt after a 2.5 hour commute home from work.

totally agree with this that Joe wrote too . The decision was arbitrary and unfairly applied , if personal attacks are not allowed then both posters in that particular fray were guilty .

There have been reams of threads where the matter of the OP has been abandoned in favour of sarcastic videos or one line detractions and these have gone on and on with no mod response.

It makes any real discussion in here pointless . There seems to be a greater appetite for personal attacks than there is for issue based debate.

Either the rules apply to everyone equally or they are not applied at all.

[Bruce Dazzling]

Its a big deal if there's one standard for some people and another for others, especially if the decision is based on how someone felt after a 2.5 hour commute home from work.

totally agree with this that Joe wrote too . The decision was arbitrary and unfairly applied , if personal attacks are not allowed then both posters in that particular fray were guilty .

There have been reams of threads where the matter of the OP has been abandoned in favour of sarcastic videos or one line detractions and these have gone on and on with no mod response.

It makes any real discussion in here pointless . There seems to be a greater appetite for personal attacks than there is for issue based debate.

Either the rules apply to everyone equally or they are not applied at all.

Not all personal attacks are equal.

For example, Simulist's quote below is a criticism of the application of logic to an argument, which is pretty much one of the main purposes of this board. Especially when the argument posits the position that (gore warning) these people are either photoshopped, lying, and/or "just greedy mother fuckers who are keeping quiet for the money."

If you haven't figured even that out yet, it's no wonder you come up with all the crackpot stuff you promote here so readily.

Simulist could have been more tactful about it, and he was warned, publicly and privately, but I determined that it didn't rise to the level of a suspendable personal attack, because again, he was criticizing the logic of C_w's arguments, as opposed to just name-calling.

And incidentally, We (the mods) have allowed the promotion of those theories for page after page, over multiple threads, for the past six weeks or so. Until now, C_w has been able to say whatever she wanted to say about "crisis actors," photoshopped disaster scenes, and greedy, mother fucking, impromptu amputee victims.

C_w's below quote, on the other hand, is just name-calling. Period. It has no purpose, other than to denigrate and incite, and as I said, after I took a bit of time to reflect, when I wasn't in a panic to catch my bus, I determined that it rose to the level of a suspendable offense, especially when coupled with other recent warnings C_w has received from myself as well as the other mods behind the scenes.

and if you haven't figured out that there's plenty of this world that is not hostile it's no wonder you come off as such an angry, classless, big mouth asshole on a continuous basis.

Now let's get this thread back on topic.

[seemslikeadream]

oh Bruce she was just trying to get this thread of mine up to 150 pages also...what's the problem? can't blame a girl for trying


and I do get a pass here for derailing since it's my thread

[ShinShinKid]

Odd sync, indeed, I've just started rereading my Landmark Herodotus!
I think the sprinkling is a cool tie-in, although something more concrete, like if any relatives had/ have been buried with horses...now that would be something!
The "Scythians" also includes a large amount of individual tribes, IIRC...Of course, traditionally, various parts of the Scythian hordes were violent towards the Persians, so maybe we have that going for us.

[Crow]

What about the parking lot incident? Is that not an expression of an anger problem?

Thank you, that's what I was thinking of.

Todashev, a mixed martial arts fighter, knocked a stranger unconscious in a bloody fight over a parking space at the Premium Outlet Mall earlier this month and was arrested on aggravated battery charges.

And a former training partner of Todashev's from Boston described him as "an incredibly gifted athlete" — with a temper....The man said Todashev frequently got into fights with people outside the gym and verbal disputes with other members.

"I never had any problems with him personally," the training partner wrote in an email. "But hearing that he was picked up for fighting over a parking space in Florida...comes as NO surprise."

The training partner said Todashev had been kicked out of several gyms for getting into altercations on the street — which he described as "a major, MAJOR no-no for people involved in Martial Arts."

That's from the Orlando Sentinel.

There is also this:

In 2010, a Boston police report stated Todashev was involved in a violent road rage incident in Downtown Crossing.

The BPD report states officers “witnessed several people struggling to restrain a white male, later determined to be the subject, Ibragim Todashev. Officers heard Todashev yell, ‘You say something about my mother, I will kill you!’ Officers struggled to physically 
restrain and handcuff Todashev. ...” His case was continued without a finding.

From the Boston Herald.

And no, canadian_watcher, I don't know him.

[Jerky]

But still, no knife. They said he had a knife. Now, no knife.

This looks bad for the FBI, regardless of whether or not the guy was an asshole (which he appeared to be).

Jerky

[Crow]

Furthermore, and most importantly, none of this has anything to do with anyone's gender. Nothing. Nada. Zip. So drop that turd in somebody else's punch bowl, or take it up with me via PM, if you must discuss it further.

In human society, sexism is always a factor. It has not yet been eradicated from anything, especially not the subconscious mind of any individual or group.

[Crow]

There were 2 large drug busts in that part of town in the same year as the murders. The one in May caught a cop who was giving aid and help so other cops could be lent on , threatened /intimidated. The sealed indictment in connection with the May bust was recently opened ,after a request i think from the defence, - not 100% sure on that part. One of the 2 dead men owned a company selling glass bongs. The impression I get is they were committed stoners selling dope but nothing harder. Wouldn't be the first time a drug patch/ type of substance war broke out with police involvement (May bust) and those who refused to move up a grade, were removed . That was my reading of the scattered drugs and money left lying about conspiciously /. Also someone talked for the 2 large busts to have taken place, maybe these guys were suspected.

I didn't know about this. But the Waltham cops have a bad reputation and this would fit in with that. I think it's in-ter-est-ing that they were unable to solve or make meaningful progress on this triple murder, especially since they had Tsarnaev's name and Tsarnaev had already been reported to the FBI as a potential terrorist and it happened on September 11, etc.

Elex, your information about Scythian funeral rituals is fascinating.

[Jerky]

Brought to the fore, cuz I missed it the first time, before Crow brought it up.

Hello all,

I usually just read along with the discussions on this forum, but I had a bit of an odd synchro/coinky-dink happen that I'm hoping to get some feedback on.

The whole Boston situation clearly does not pass the smell test, but a particular detail has been nagging at me for some reason:

http://landing.newsinc.com/shared/video ... D=24836986

Federal law enforcement sources said the FBI agent, two Massachusetts State Police troopers and other law enforcement officials were "primarily" questioning Todashev about a Sept. 11, 2011, triple slaying in Waltham, Mass. Officials believe he and Tamerlan Tsarnaev, one of the suspected Boston bombers, may have had a role in cutting the throats of the three men and sprinkling marijuana over their bodies.

I've been assuming that this detail was pasted on as a very ham-fisted attempt to create some sort of gang/drug tie-in to the official narative, but the symbolism just doesn't fit. The media is bending over backwards to portray Todashev as an out-of-control hardcore badass. 'Thhhprinkling thome of that naththy ole mawiwawa over their cold widdle tootsies' (my paraphrasing) is not the couse of action an out-of-control hardcore badass takes when he's trying to send a message, so this detail was still bugging me.

I was randomly thinking about the subject a few nights ago, and out of nowhere the words "Scythian grave ritual" pop into my head, as clear as if someone had said it out loud next to me. At this point, the only thing I know about Scythians is their name and some vauge notion that they were good with horses, so I do a quick search and right in the wikipedia entry is:

Herodotus reports that Scythians used cannabis, both to weave their clothing and to cleanse themselves in its smoke (Hist. 4.73–75); archaeology has confirmed the use of cannabis in funeral rituals.

and a different article about Scythians:

Then to that sword they bring yearly sacrifices of cattle and horses and, what’s more, to these objects right here they sacrifice still more than to all the other gods. Of all of their enemies whichever they take alive, from a hundred one man they sacrifice not in the same manner as the cattle, but in another: for, whenever they pour a libation of wine down on their heads, they cut the throat of the human beings into a vessel and thereafter they bring up, up on the pile of the pieces of firewood, and pour down on the sword the blood.

And just to throw in a bonus round power-up, if I'm juxtaposing the maps right, it looks like Chechnya is smack dab in the middle of what was Scythian territory.

Now trying to interpret this and fit it into some larger picture, I skimmed the rest of the wiki article and realized that the Scythians seem to be hugely important to many of the secret societies and spook types, and I'd have to guess they also play a large part in many alternate/hidden/occult versions of history,

There's a good chance that this is just a rabbithole, but considering the hard-on that most puppetmasters have for symbolism and getting the details "just right", I have to wonder. If anyone here knows more about Scythian influences/culture/history and how it might fit in symboliclly I'd love to hear about it.

Cheers,
Elex

[Crow]

Now let's get this thread back on topic.

Sorry, just saw this. Hadn't read to the end of the thread. Shutting up now.

[Crow]

But still, no knife. They said he had a knife. Now, no knife.

This looks bad for the FBI, regardless of whether or not the guy was an asshole (which he appeared to be).

Jerky

Extremely.

[stickdog99]

When the actual story comes out, I suspect that just one or two agents will have witnessed the deadly altercation.

As I was saying:

Todashev Never Had a Shiv

The Chechen man who was fatally shot by an FBI agent last week during an interview about one of the Boston bombing suspects was unarmed, law enforcement officials said Wednesday.

An air of mystery has surrounded the FBI shooting of Ibragim Todashev, 27, since it occurred in Todashev’s apartment early on the morning of May 22. The FBI said in a news release that day that Todashev, a former Boston resident who knew bombing suspect Tamerlan Tsarnaev, was killed during an interview with several law enforcement officers.

The FBI has provided few other details, saying that the matter is being investigated by an FBI review team that may not finish its probe for several months.

“The FBI takes very seriously any shooting incidents involving our agents and as such we have an effective, time-tested process for addressing them internally,” FBI spokesman Paul Bresson said in a statement Wednesday. “The review process is thorough and objective and conducted as expeditiously as possible under the circumstances.”

The Florida chapter of the Council on American-Islamic Relations on Wednesday called for an independent investigation by the Justice Department’s Civil Rights Division. Officials said the division and local prosecutors are already reviewing the case.

At the time of the shooting, Todashev was being interviewed about his possible connection to a triple murder in Waltham, Mass., on Sept. 11, 2011. Law enforcement officials said he had acknowledged involvement in the murders and had implicated Tsarnaev. Officials said Todashev was not suspected of involvement in the April 15 Boston bombing.

Tsarnaev was killed in a shootout with police four days after the bombing. His younger brother, Dzhokhar, was captured later that day and remains in custody.

In the statement about Todashev’s shooting issued on the day of the incident, the FBI said that an agent, along with two Massachusetts State Police troopers and other law enforcement personnel, were interviewing “an individual” in connection with the Boston Marathon bombing investigation when a “violent confrontation was initiated by the individual.”

An agent sustained non-life-threatening injuries, later described by one law enforcement official as “some cuts and abrasions.”

Initial reports citing anonymous law-enforcement individuals provided conflicting accounts of what happened. Some law enforcement officials said Todashev wielded a knife and others suggested that he attempted to grab the FBI agent’s gun.

One law enforcement official, speaking on the condition of anonymity to discuss an ongoing investigation, said Wednesday that Todashev lunged at the agent and overturned a table. But the official said Todashev did not have a gun or a knife. A second official also said Todashev was unarmed.

An official said that according to one account of the shooting, the other law enforcement officials had just stepped out of the room, leaving the FBI agent alone with Todashev, when the confrontation occurred. The shooting followed hours of questioning by the law enforcement officials that had begun the night before.

Todashev’s father said after the shooting that he didn’t believe the FBI’s account of why they killed his son. “My son could never commit a crime, I know my son too well,” Abdul-Baki Todashev, who lives in Chechnya, told the Daily Beast Web site. “He worked helping disabled people in America and did sports, coached other sportsmen. The FBI made up their accusations.”

[8bitagent]

Then there's this:

Obama appoints former Dubya official as new head of the FBI
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/05 ... urces?lite

[seemslikeadream]

why isn't this guy in a room with a few FBI people?

Leader of Armed March On Washington Calls For ‘Revolutionary Army’ To Topple Government
By Ian Millhiser on May 29, 2013 at 5:05 pm

Thousands of people signed up to attend an armed march on Washington over the course of the last month. But now, the leader of the march is setting his sights much higher than a single demonstration — he wants his armed followers to help overthrow the American government.
About a month ago, a gun activist named Adam Kokesh called for thousands of people to join him in an armed march on Washington, D.C. to “put the government on notice that we will not be intimidated & cower in submission to tyranny.” As of this writing, nearly 5,200 people have RSVPed for Kokesh’s armed march.
Late last week, however, Kokesh decided to abandon this march in favor of a much larger effort to bring down the entire federal government. In a statement written from a jail cell in Philadelphia (Kokesh faced charges for allegedly resisting arrest during a pro-marijuana rally. He now says he’s been released), the gun activist called for his supporters to form a secessionist “army”:
A new American revolution is long overdue. This revolution has been brewing in the hearts and minds of the people for many years, but this Independence Day, it shall take a new form as the American Revolutionary Army will march on each state capital to demand that the governors of these 50 states immediately initiate the process of an orderly dissolution of the federal government through secession and reclamation of federally held property. Should one whole year from this July 4th pass while the crimes of this government are allowed to continue, we may have passed the point at which non-violent revolution becomes impossible.
The time to sit idly by has passed. To remain neutral is to be complicit, just doing your job is not an excuse, and the line in the sand has been drawn between the people, and the criminals in Washington, D.C. While some timid souls will say that it is too early, that we can solve this problem through democratic means provided by government, that current levels of taxation are reasonable for the services provided, and that the crimes of this government are merely a tolerable nuisance, it may already be too late.
To be sure, it is likely that only a small minority of Americans will rally to a cry to march upon their state capitols and demand that the United States cease to exist. But Kokesh’s call is troubling for the simple reason that he was capable of convincing over 5,000 people to sign up for an armed march on Washington, D.C. It does not take much imagination to figure out what could go wrong if just a few dozen armed and angry secessionists show up at state capitols throughout the country.

ok probably cause he's white?...and actually has a gun?...or two or three?....or 50?

[seemslikeadream]

Father of man FBI shot claims his son was executed

By MAX SEDDON
Associated Press / May 30, 2013

MOSCOW (AP) — The father of a Chechen immigrant killed in Florida while being interrogated by the FBI about his ties to a Boston Marathon bombings suspect said Thursday that the U.S. agents killed his son ‘‘execution-style.’’

At news conference in Moscow, Abdul-Baki Todashev showed journalists 16 photographs that he said were of his son, Ibragim, in a Florida morgue. He said his son had six gunshot wounds to his torso and one to the back of his head and the pictures were taken by his son’s friend, Khusen Taramov.

It was not immediately possible to authenticate the photographs.

The FBI says 27-year-old mixed martial arts fighter Ibragim Todashev was killed last week during a violent confrontation in his Orlando home while an FBI agent and two Massachusetts state troopers questioned him about his ties to slain Boston Marathon bombing suspect Tamerlan Tsarnaev, as well as about a 2011 triple slaying in Massachusetts.

Three law enforcement officials said initially that Todashev had lunged at the FBI agent with a knife, although two of them later said it was no longer clear what had happened.

Greg Comcowich, a spokesman for the Boston FBI, declined to comment Thursday on the elder Todashev’s claim that his son was unarmed.

Abdul-Baki Todashev said the photos were emailed to him by Taramov, who apparently was at the morgue to identify the body. The father said Taramov was part of the Muslim community holding the body for the family until they could retrieve it.

The father said Taramov told him that U.S. agents interrogated him on the street while five officials interrogated Todashev in his Florida house for eight hours on May 22, the night he was shot. He said his son was ‘‘100 percent unarmed.’’

Todashev’s father said his son moved to the U.S. in 2008 on a study exchange program and met Tsarnaev at a boxing gym in Boston in 2011, about a year before he moved to Orlando. He said the two were ‘‘not particularly close friends.’’

Prior to last month’s bombings, Todashev underwent an operation for a sports injury and was on crutches, making it physically impossible for him to have been involved in the bombings, his father said. He added that Todashev had recently received a green card and was planning to return to Chechnya for the summer last Friday, two days after he was killed.

The father said he and his brother were interviewed at the U.S. Embassy in Moscow on Thursday as they sought a visa to take his son’s body back to Chechnya.

FBI agents interrogated the younger Todashev twice before the night he was shot, his father said. Todashev told him that he thought Tsarnaev had been set up to take blame for the bombings.

‘‘I'd only seen and heard things like that in the movies — they shoot somebody and then a shot in the head to make sure,’’ Todashev said.

‘‘These just aren’t FBI agents, they’re bandits,’’ he added.